http://www.denbeste.nu/
edit: Original article that inspired me to post this thread:
http://denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2002/12/Oldwineinnewbottles.shtml
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 12-26-2002).]
Good Reading...
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">We are created as a nation from the dregs of Europe, its huddled masses; we are a nation built from the lowest of Europe's low. We are its slum dwellers who worked long hours in its factories for a pittance, its starving farmers after crop failure, its persecuted religious minorities, its persecuted ethnic minorities, its refugees. Only Australia can proudly claim to be built of even worse scum than America.
We are primarily made of the Europeans who whose lives in Europe were so desperate, so miserable, so hopeless, that it was worth any risk and sacrifice for even a chance at something better. And we are the ones who were willing to leave everything they knew to go to a strange land with strange customs and a strange language. We are the ones who were willing to cross an ocean in the hold of a smelly steamship in hopes that when we arrived that America would let us enter. We're the millions who came through Ellis island, not knowing until the last instant if we'd have to turn around and go back to the hell-hole from which we came. We're the ones who were willing to gamble everything on that chance of entry, and the ones who knew what a blessing that chance represented when we got it, and the determination to make as much of that chance as we could.
But there's something else: we are the ones who hated the European class system. We are the ones who chafed at the roles that European low birth forced on us. We are the ones who wanted to escape from that and decide for ourselves what we would become, to make our own decisions, and to become as much as we were able to become even if it meant transcending the class of our birth. The selection process for who left Europe and who stayed favored those who wanted release from European stratification, and that's why we're the huddled masses yearning to be free.
And freed from the tyranny of the European class system, we have built a great and powerful nation, which has eclipsed the nations of Europe and even shamed them with its success. Commoners aren't supposed to be able to do that kind of thing unsupervised.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
this part made me feel warm and happy inside.
We are primarily made of the Europeans who whose lives in Europe were so desperate, so miserable, so hopeless, that it was worth any risk and sacrifice for even a chance at something better. And we are the ones who were willing to leave everything they knew to go to a strange land with strange customs and a strange language. We are the ones who were willing to cross an ocean in the hold of a smelly steamship in hopes that when we arrived that America would let us enter. We're the millions who came through Ellis island, not knowing until the last instant if we'd have to turn around and go back to the hell-hole from which we came. We're the ones who were willing to gamble everything on that chance of entry, and the ones who knew what a blessing that chance represented when we got it, and the determination to make as much of that chance as we could.
But there's something else: we are the ones who hated the European class system. We are the ones who chafed at the roles that European low birth forced on us. We are the ones who wanted to escape from that and decide for ourselves what we would become, to make our own decisions, and to become as much as we were able to become even if it meant transcending the class of our birth. The selection process for who left Europe and who stayed favored those who wanted release from European stratification, and that's why we're the huddled masses yearning to be free.
And freed from the tyranny of the European class system, we have built a great and powerful nation, which has eclipsed the nations of Europe and even shamed them with its success. Commoners aren't supposed to be able to do that kind of thing unsupervised.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
this part made me feel warm and happy inside.
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">I have worked in companies, and I have had bosses, and they tell me what to do and I do what they say because they pay me. But when they tell me what to do they do so respectfully; if they treat me contemptuously I'll quit. I work for them but they do not own me. I call no man "Mister" or "Sir", and if I meet the President of the company I will look him square in the eye, hold out my hand to shake his as an equal, and I will call him by his first name. I will give him respect he is due for his knowledge and performance, but I abase myself to no man. If I had the privilege of meeting President Bush, I would look him in the eye and shake his hand the same way. I will not cast my eyes downward for anyone. And neither will my nation.</font>
this page is bookmarked, and getting better.
ok, i really dig this page - i have not come across such a diverse collection of world views and opinions, coupled with links, statistics, and individual commentary in as long as i can remember.
i read the part about the US/EU ongoing power struggle, then i moved onto the discussions of ww2 weaponry and the various roles that the nations played in that.
now, i am reading about the north/south korean conflict. it is amazing just how much i do not know, despite striving to know it all. i think that the US government could use a foreign policy enlightenment department. so many issues that just get brushed away by the media, while the *real* knowledge is held in reserve by the dedicated preservists.
thanks Corth, for this awesome site.
i read the part about the US/EU ongoing power struggle, then i moved onto the discussions of ww2 weaponry and the various roles that the nations played in that.
now, i am reading about the north/south korean conflict. it is amazing just how much i do not know, despite striving to know it all. i think that the US government could use a foreign policy enlightenment department. so many issues that just get brushed away by the media, while the *real* knowledge is held in reserve by the dedicated preservists.
thanks Corth, for this awesome site.
So black and white. But I'd expect nothing else from a site that blows the "we're the best" horn.
Everyone who left, was good. Everyone who stayed, was bad.
Everyone who left, were daring. Everyone who stayed, wasn't.
Everyone who left, hated the class system. Everyone who stayed, didn't.
Everyone who left, was willing to take a chance. Everyone who stayed, wasn't.
Full of shit, that's what it is. Whoever wrote that has NO idea what went through people's minds, or what situation they were in.
Everyone who left, was good. Everyone who stayed, was bad.
Everyone who left, were daring. Everyone who stayed, wasn't.
Everyone who left, hated the class system. Everyone who stayed, didn't.
Everyone who left, was willing to take a chance. Everyone who stayed, wasn't.
Full of shit, that's what it is. Whoever wrote that has NO idea what went through people's minds, or what situation they were in.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by cherzra:
Whoever wrote that has NO idea what went through people's minds, or what situation they were in.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
OK, now you're getting extreme.
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Toarn group-says 'my lvl 50 buffer has officially been Mori-fied.'
Shevarash tells you 'you want to mud marry me? *scratch*'
Whoever wrote that has NO idea what went through people's minds, or what situation they were in.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
OK, now you're getting extreme.
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Toarn group-says 'my lvl 50 buffer has officially been Mori-fied.'
Shevarash tells you 'you want to mud marry me? *scratch*'
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by cherzra:
So black and white.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Well Cherzra, not everyone is blessed with as keen an aptitude for subtle and nuanced reasoning as you are.
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
So black and white.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Well Cherzra, not everyone is blessed with as keen an aptitude for subtle and nuanced reasoning as you are.
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
http://www.denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2002/12/Partlyemptyormostlyfull.shtml
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Goddamned slippery mage.
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Goddamned slippery mage.
http://www.denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2002/12/TheoryY.shtml
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Goddamned slippery mage.
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Goddamned slippery mage.
http://www.nationalinterest.org/issues/58/Mead.html
Fairly long article. It makes a few too many generalizations, but its a fairly decent and unbiased attempt to define, contextualize, and criticize the 'Jacksonian' thread of american culture which so infuriates American liberals and foreigners.
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Goddamned slippery mage.
Fairly long article. It makes a few too many generalizations, but its a fairly decent and unbiased attempt to define, contextualize, and criticize the 'Jacksonian' thread of american culture which so infuriates American liberals and foreigners.
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Goddamned slippery mage.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Jegzed:
<B>I just find the site name hilarious...
denbeste.nu = "The best.now" in scandinavian
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Was perusing the site a little more and found some biographical information on the guy who runs it. Turns out the guy is named Steven Debeste, and theres an interesting story of how he got that surname:
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
A lot of people ask me about my surname. There's an interesting story behind it.
It doesn't go back very far, actually. Because there's no aristocracy in the US, people like to pretend that they're descended from the nobility in Europe. (In actual practice, for most of them if they actually had an honest crest at all, it would bear the bar sinister!)
Not me. My ancestry is Dutch (Frisian) and I come from a long line of farmers and pirates. My ancestry is strictly common, and historically the commoners in Frisia didn't have surnames. Only the nobles had surnames; the rest of us were named things like "Johann with the twisted lip" or "Blue-eyed Hans".
Until, that is, the French invaded the place and ran it during the Napoleonic wars for about 7 years. Now Napoleon was really big on taxing the provinces so he could keep the taxes back in France low. The countries he conquered all had to pony up bigtime to pay him for the privilege of having been conquered by him. So the French called everyone in the Netherlands in and required them to pick surnames, I assume so that an accurate census could be made, so that they could tax the place better.
Well! Surnames for commoners! What a stupid idea! And it's these silly French invaders making us do this. They've got all the guns, but they can't make us take it seriously, now can they?
So a bunch of the people made up facetious or otherwise strange names. What they didn't expect was that after the war, when the French were kicked back out again, that the Dutch government would keep those names for everyone.
There are a number of people living in the Netherlands whose surname is Poepjes, which translated into English means "little pieces of shit".
My paternal ancestor was also a smartass, but at least he had better taste. My surname means "The Best" in not only Dutch but also in several Scandanavian languages which are in the Germanic group.
I kind of like the idea of being descended from a smartass.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
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Goddamned slippery mage.
<B>I just find the site name hilarious...
denbeste.nu = "The best.now" in scandinavian
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Was perusing the site a little more and found some biographical information on the guy who runs it. Turns out the guy is named Steven Debeste, and theres an interesting story of how he got that surname:
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
A lot of people ask me about my surname. There's an interesting story behind it.
It doesn't go back very far, actually. Because there's no aristocracy in the US, people like to pretend that they're descended from the nobility in Europe. (In actual practice, for most of them if they actually had an honest crest at all, it would bear the bar sinister!)
Not me. My ancestry is Dutch (Frisian) and I come from a long line of farmers and pirates. My ancestry is strictly common, and historically the commoners in Frisia didn't have surnames. Only the nobles had surnames; the rest of us were named things like "Johann with the twisted lip" or "Blue-eyed Hans".
Until, that is, the French invaded the place and ran it during the Napoleonic wars for about 7 years. Now Napoleon was really big on taxing the provinces so he could keep the taxes back in France low. The countries he conquered all had to pony up bigtime to pay him for the privilege of having been conquered by him. So the French called everyone in the Netherlands in and required them to pick surnames, I assume so that an accurate census could be made, so that they could tax the place better.
Well! Surnames for commoners! What a stupid idea! And it's these silly French invaders making us do this. They've got all the guns, but they can't make us take it seriously, now can they?
So a bunch of the people made up facetious or otherwise strange names. What they didn't expect was that after the war, when the French were kicked back out again, that the Dutch government would keep those names for everyone.
There are a number of people living in the Netherlands whose surname is Poepjes, which translated into English means "little pieces of shit".
My paternal ancestor was also a smartass, but at least he had better taste. My surname means "The Best" in not only Dutch but also in several Scandanavian languages which are in the Germanic group.
I kind of like the idea of being descended from a smartass.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
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Goddamned slippery mage.
As for the .NU extension
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
What's with the .nu extension? It is the official code for the island of Niue in Polynesia. They sold rights to it to NuNames which is located in Cambridge MA, which uses its profits for the benefit of the residents of Niue. My reason for going with it was two-fold: denbeste.com was taken, and by going through NuNames not one cent of my money went to the blood suckers at Network Solutions. I've registered denbeste.nu for 10 years.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
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Goddamned slippery mage.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
What's with the .nu extension? It is the official code for the island of Niue in Polynesia. They sold rights to it to NuNames which is located in Cambridge MA, which uses its profits for the benefit of the residents of Niue. My reason for going with it was two-fold: denbeste.com was taken, and by going through NuNames not one cent of my money went to the blood suckers at Network Solutions. I've registered denbeste.nu for 10 years.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
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Goddamned slippery mage.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by cherzra:
[B]So black and white. But I'd expect nothing else from a site that blows the "we're the best" horn.
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Smirk!
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[B]So black and white. But I'd expect nothing else from a site that blows the "we're the best" horn.
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Smirk!
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Goddamned slippery mage.
http://denbeste.nu/external/Kagan01.html
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
Today's transatlantic problem, in short, is not a George Bush problem. It is a power problem. American military strength has produced a propensity to use that strength. Europe's military weakness has produced a perfectly understandable aversion to the exercise of military power. Indeed, it has produced a powerful European interest in inhabiting a world where strength doesn't matter, where international law and international institutions predominate, where unilateral action by powerful nations is forbidden, where all nations regardless of their strength have equal rights and are equally protected by commonly agreed-upon international rules of behavior. Europeans have a deep interest in devaluing and eventually eradicating the brutal laws of an anarchic, Hobbesian world where power is the ultimate determinant of national security and success.
This is no reproach. It is what weaker powers have wanted from time immemorial. It was what Americans wanted in the eighteenth and early nineteenth centuries, when the brutality of a European system of power politics run by the global giants of France, Britain, and Russia left Americans constantly vulnerable to imperial thrashing. It was what the other small powers of Europe wanted in those years, too, only to be sneered at by Bourbon kings and other powerful monarchs, who spoke instead of raison d'état. The great proponent of international law on the high seas in the eighteenth century was the United States; the great opponent was Britain's navy, the "Mistress of the Seas." In an anarchic world, small powers always fear they will be victims. Great powers, on the other hand, often fear rules that may constrain them more than they fear the anarchy in which their power brings security and prosperity
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
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Goddamned slippery mage.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
Today's transatlantic problem, in short, is not a George Bush problem. It is a power problem. American military strength has produced a propensity to use that strength. Europe's military weakness has produced a perfectly understandable aversion to the exercise of military power. Indeed, it has produced a powerful European interest in inhabiting a world where strength doesn't matter, where international law and international institutions predominate, where unilateral action by powerful nations is forbidden, where all nations regardless of their strength have equal rights and are equally protected by commonly agreed-upon international rules of behavior. Europeans have a deep interest in devaluing and eventually eradicating the brutal laws of an anarchic, Hobbesian world where power is the ultimate determinant of national security and success.
This is no reproach. It is what weaker powers have wanted from time immemorial. It was what Americans wanted in the eighteenth and early nineteenth centuries, when the brutality of a European system of power politics run by the global giants of France, Britain, and Russia left Americans constantly vulnerable to imperial thrashing. It was what the other small powers of Europe wanted in those years, too, only to be sneered at by Bourbon kings and other powerful monarchs, who spoke instead of raison d'état. The great proponent of international law on the high seas in the eighteenth century was the United States; the great opponent was Britain's navy, the "Mistress of the Seas." In an anarchic world, small powers always fear they will be victims. Great powers, on the other hand, often fear rules that may constrain them more than they fear the anarchy in which their power brings security and prosperity
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
------------------
Goddamned slippery mage.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2"><B>My ancestry is Dutch (Frisian) and I come from a long line of farmers and pirates. My ancestry is strictly common, and historically the commoners in Frisia didn't have surnames.
Until, that is, the French invaded the place and ran it during the Napoleonic wars for about 7 years.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Cute story. However, my maternal grandparents were from Friesland, most definitely not of the aristocracy, and both families had surnames well before Napoleon. Grandmother's family has had the surname traced back to the 15th Century.
The rest of the story sounds like what the Romany or Gypsies would sometimes do when dealing with governments. However, they would make up obscene surnames in their own language, i.e., not a language any official might actually know.
Until, that is, the French invaded the place and ran it during the Napoleonic wars for about 7 years.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Cute story. However, my maternal grandparents were from Friesland, most definitely not of the aristocracy, and both families had surnames well before Napoleon. Grandmother's family has had the surname traced back to the 15th Century.
The rest of the story sounds like what the Romany or Gypsies would sometimes do when dealing with governments. However, they would make up obscene surnames in their own language, i.e., not a language any official might actually know.
Terrorism = perversion. Release of pent up sexual repression and rage that results from islamic culture.
http://www.frontpagemagazine.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=241
http://www.frontpagemagazine.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=244
http://www.frontpagemagazine.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=246
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Goddamned slippery mage.
http://www.frontpagemagazine.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=241
http://www.frontpagemagazine.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=244
http://www.frontpagemagazine.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=246
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Goddamned slippery mage.
I came across a real diamond in the rough. Its an extract of an address given on December 7, 1996 by "Comrade" Kim Jong-il, on the fiftieth anniversary of the founding of the Kim Il-sung University. While reading this, keep in mind that this moron either has, or soon will have nuclear capabilities.
http://www.kimsoft.com/korea/kji-kisu.htm
The most amusing part for me has to be this little tidbit on why its not really his fault that his country is the biggest shithole in asia:
Don't believe North Korea is a shithole? Check this out:
The above map indicates light and heat sources on the Korean peninsula. The red part and surrounding area in the center of the map is Seoul. Kind of barren on the Northern part eh? Well there is that little blue dot.. err I mean Pyongyang.
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-04-2003).]
http://www.kimsoft.com/korea/kji-kisu.htm
The most amusing part for me has to be this little tidbit on why its not really his fault that his country is the biggest shithole in asia:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">In this complex situation, I cannot solve all the problems while I have the duty of being in charge of practical economic projects as well as the overall economy as I have to control important sectors such as the military and the party as well. If I conce ntrated only on the economy there would be irrecoverable damage to the revolution. The great leader told me when he was alive never to be involved in economic projects, just concentrate on the military and the party and leave economics to party functionar ies. If I do delve into economics then I cannot run the party and the military effectively. </font>
Don't believe North Korea is a shithole? Check this out:
The above map indicates light and heat sources on the Korean peninsula. The red part and surrounding area in the center of the map is Seoul. Kind of barren on the Northern part eh? Well there is that little blue dot.. err I mean Pyongyang.
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-04-2003).]
Exploiting the Palestinians
Everyone's doing it.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/002/072nmqjh.asp
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Goddamned slippery mage.
Everyone's doing it.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/002/072nmqjh.asp
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Goddamned slippery mage.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Corth:
<B>
The above map indicates light and heat sources on the Korean peninsula. The red part and surrounding area in the center of the map is Seoul. Kind of barren on the Northern part eh? Well there is that little blue dot.. err I mean Pyongyang.
Corth
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Interview with Mini-me Great Leader by Corth:
But the great leader told mini-me great leader jr. when he was alive that by developing nuclear weapons. We can light up the Korean peninsula bright red and provide great heat source instantly. Nuclear weapons will also help our great economy by selling it to terrorists and anyone willing to pay us. And it lets me, the mini-me great leader to focus on important matters of the party and military while brainwashing young north koreans for the future.
<B>
The above map indicates light and heat sources on the Korean peninsula. The red part and surrounding area in the center of the map is Seoul. Kind of barren on the Northern part eh? Well there is that little blue dot.. err I mean Pyongyang.
Corth
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Interview with Mini-me Great Leader by Corth:
But the great leader told mini-me great leader jr. when he was alive that by developing nuclear weapons. We can light up the Korean peninsula bright red and provide great heat source instantly. Nuclear weapons will also help our great economy by selling it to terrorists and anyone willing to pay us. And it lets me, the mini-me great leader to focus on important matters of the party and military while brainwashing young north koreans for the future.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">That's the situation with respect to Iraq. European leaders apparently want to prevent war and destabilization of the region. They're looking for some way to accomplish the limited goal of actually getting Iraq to eliminate its WMDs and delivery systems (and failing even at that limited objective). But even if they succeeded, it isn't enough for us. Our objective for the region is much larger and the European solution would be a defeat for us. We actually want the region to be destabilized; it's an essential part of our long term strategy. Since that's what the Europeans are trying to prevent, that makes them an opponent within the context of this particular war.
Europe wants as little disruption as possible; we want as much as we can manage. Europe wants to maintain all the existing governments (including Saddam's) in power; we want them all changed. Europe wants to maintain the status quo; we want to rototill the existing order and replace it with something better. There is no common ground.
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://www.denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2003/01/TheEUpeaceplan.shtml
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Goddamned slippery mage.
Europe wants as little disruption as possible; we want as much as we can manage. Europe wants to maintain all the existing governments (including Saddam's) in power; we want them all changed. Europe wants to maintain the status quo; we want to rototill the existing order and replace it with something better. There is no common ground.
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://www.denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2003/01/TheEUpeaceplan.shtml
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Goddamned slippery mage.
http://jama.ama-assn.org/issues/v288n21/ffull/jlt1204-3.html
Letter to the journal of the american medical association. Apparently, NYC subway stations are being scanned for radioactive material. Patients being treated with radioactive iodine stopped and strip searched. That must be some seriously sensitive detection equipment.
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Goddamned slippery mage.
Letter to the journal of the american medical association. Apparently, NYC subway stations are being scanned for radioactive material. Patients being treated with radioactive iodine stopped and strip searched. That must be some seriously sensitive detection equipment.
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Goddamned slippery mage.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">With North Korea ratcheting up the pressure, evidently because it is facing imminent internal meltdown, the US is playing the situation exactly as it should. Time is on our side, so we're moving "deliberately", which is to say that we're moving slowly. And US envoy Kelly is now saying that the process of resolving the crisis is going to be a very slow one.
This is exactly the right approach, because North Korea is trying to panic us into working for a quick solution which would permit them to wring huge concessions out of us. But they are the ones who are truly in a hurry, and if we refuse to be rushed, and as they face disaster, and as their increasing attempts to cause hysteria obviously fail, they'll pull back and then they will be the ones who make major concessions.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://www.denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2003/01/Aslowprocess.shtml
So I guess the million dollar question is whether 'mini me great leader jr' (thanks iktar) will still be concentrating solely on the military when his back is firmly against the wall of an economic meltdown. Thats what they have been threatening for years. Essentially their argument is 'support our failed country or we will have no reason to refrain from unleashing our hordes upon the south' At least the Europeans are more subtle and less violent. They want us to support their failed institutions (UN) or they'll unleash hordes of insults upon us.
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-16-2003).]
This is exactly the right approach, because North Korea is trying to panic us into working for a quick solution which would permit them to wring huge concessions out of us. But they are the ones who are truly in a hurry, and if we refuse to be rushed, and as they face disaster, and as their increasing attempts to cause hysteria obviously fail, they'll pull back and then they will be the ones who make major concessions.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://www.denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2003/01/Aslowprocess.shtml
So I guess the million dollar question is whether 'mini me great leader jr' (thanks iktar) will still be concentrating solely on the military when his back is firmly against the wall of an economic meltdown. Thats what they have been threatening for years. Essentially their argument is 'support our failed country or we will have no reason to refrain from unleashing our hordes upon the south' At least the Europeans are more subtle and less violent. They want us to support their failed institutions (UN) or they'll unleash hordes of insults upon us.
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-16-2003).]
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,408784,00.html
This is interesting. Apparently Saudi Arabia is working behind the scenes to avoid a war in iraq by staging a coup there. The purpose would be to avoid a chaotic transition of power by allowing many of the iraqi institutions, such as the military, to stay in place. The arab leaders are incredibly concerned about what happens in iraq because the whole region is teetering on the brink of a meltdown. Civil war in Iran is not out of the question. Turkey might take territorial liberties should iraq be weakened. The arab 'street' is inflamed with militant islamism. And worst yet for the despotic arab regimes, destabalization means that their own power could be in jeopardy. I think that by simply getting them worried about their own asses, Bush has won. Islamic terrorism has thrived for years due to the tacit support of the arab countries. Its going to be a long time before the arabs give anyone a reason to levy such scrutiny against them once again. In other words, they will learn to police themselves. Thats assuming that these regimes even survive the next couple of years. It might come down to a question of ambition. Does Bush really want to 'rototill' the region and plant the seeds of democracy? Perhaps he is content with teaching them that its a bad idea to fuck with the USA.
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-16-2003).]
This is interesting. Apparently Saudi Arabia is working behind the scenes to avoid a war in iraq by staging a coup there. The purpose would be to avoid a chaotic transition of power by allowing many of the iraqi institutions, such as the military, to stay in place. The arab leaders are incredibly concerned about what happens in iraq because the whole region is teetering on the brink of a meltdown. Civil war in Iran is not out of the question. Turkey might take territorial liberties should iraq be weakened. The arab 'street' is inflamed with militant islamism. And worst yet for the despotic arab regimes, destabalization means that their own power could be in jeopardy. I think that by simply getting them worried about their own asses, Bush has won. Islamic terrorism has thrived for years due to the tacit support of the arab countries. Its going to be a long time before the arabs give anyone a reason to levy such scrutiny against them once again. In other words, they will learn to police themselves. Thats assuming that these regimes even survive the next couple of years. It might come down to a question of ambition. Does Bush really want to 'rototill' the region and plant the seeds of democracy? Perhaps he is content with teaching them that its a bad idea to fuck with the USA.
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-16-2003).]
Why have prominent feminists and feminist organizations remained silent in the face of horrendous atrocities committed against women in islamic countries? Genital mutilation. Honor killings. Burqas. Gang rape in Pakistan as a form of judicial punishment. Religious police in Saudi Arabia pushing girls back into their burning school because they weren't dressed appropriately to be seen in public. These atrocities aren't disputed. They are a matter of public record. So why are prominent feminists focusing their energies on such trifling concerns as female membership in private country clubs? Recognizing the profoundly beneficial impact on society that feminism has produced in recent history, the author tries to figure out why modern feminism has lost the ability to "make the universalist moral claims of equal dignity and individual freedom that once rendered it so compelling." The resulting article should be required reading for all pol-sci and philosophy students.
http://www.city-journal.org/html/13_1_why_feminism.html
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-16-2003).]
http://www.city-journal.org/html/13_1_why_feminism.html
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-16-2003).]
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A64216-2003Jan16.html
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Goddamned slippery mage.
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Goddamned slippery mage.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">ElBaradei voiced fresh frustration with Iraq Saturday after inspectors raided the scientist's house and found 3,000 pages of material apparently related to enrichment of uranium that could be used for nuclear weapons.
"Iraq should be pro-active. We shouldn't have to find these on our own," ElBaradei, head of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), told CNN. </font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20030119/wl_nm/iraq_blix_worry_dc_1
Heres a theory. Kofi Annon, head of the UN, after consultation with France and Germany, comes to the conclusion that war in Iraq is inevitable. Now, if Bush starts his war against the express wishes of the UN, what does this say about the UN? It says that the organization is completely impotent. Everyone concerned understands that the very existance of the UN is in jeopardy. So what should Annon do to save the it? Easy. Get Bush his permission. Make sure that Iraq is in material breach and get Bush his coalition. For months the plan has been to delay any hostilities by not finding anything. Having not found anything for months, the inspectors made two separate and significant discoveries in just one day. The plan has changed. What the UN now wants to do is justify the American invasion. The US gets what they want but only after the Europeans give permission. This means that the Europeans get to keep the one sphere of power that remains for them... the diplomatic sphere. The only loss that the Europeans suffer is economic since they do lots of business in the region. And best of all, Hussein gets his ass kicked. Everyone gets to save face. Its the perfect solution.. unless you *want* to see the UN rendered impotent.
So what evidence do I have? Admittedly, its very circumstantial. First, it makes sense in that everyone involved would gain or at least suffer few losses. The only other thing is the quoted passage above. All of a sudden the agreement that Iraq signed is being portrayed in a different light. Iraq is actually supposed to cooperate in a material and significant way. For months we have been under the impression that Iraq signed an agreement that merely allowed the inspectors back in. But this is wrong. The agreement was for Iraq to allow inspectors back and then do the inspector's job for them. By changing the perceived burden of proof, the UN is laying the groundwork for making a credible argument to the world (but in particular, the European 'street') that Hussein has not met his responsibilities under the agreement he signed. Its a lot easier to show that Iraq is 'uncooperative' or not 'pro-active' than it is to dig up evidence (sometimes quite literally) that they are still planning to develope WMD's.
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-19-2003).]
"Iraq should be pro-active. We shouldn't have to find these on our own," ElBaradei, head of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), told CNN. </font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20030119/wl_nm/iraq_blix_worry_dc_1
Heres a theory. Kofi Annon, head of the UN, after consultation with France and Germany, comes to the conclusion that war in Iraq is inevitable. Now, if Bush starts his war against the express wishes of the UN, what does this say about the UN? It says that the organization is completely impotent. Everyone concerned understands that the very existance of the UN is in jeopardy. So what should Annon do to save the it? Easy. Get Bush his permission. Make sure that Iraq is in material breach and get Bush his coalition. For months the plan has been to delay any hostilities by not finding anything. Having not found anything for months, the inspectors made two separate and significant discoveries in just one day. The plan has changed. What the UN now wants to do is justify the American invasion. The US gets what they want but only after the Europeans give permission. This means that the Europeans get to keep the one sphere of power that remains for them... the diplomatic sphere. The only loss that the Europeans suffer is economic since they do lots of business in the region. And best of all, Hussein gets his ass kicked. Everyone gets to save face. Its the perfect solution.. unless you *want* to see the UN rendered impotent.
So what evidence do I have? Admittedly, its very circumstantial. First, it makes sense in that everyone involved would gain or at least suffer few losses. The only other thing is the quoted passage above. All of a sudden the agreement that Iraq signed is being portrayed in a different light. Iraq is actually supposed to cooperate in a material and significant way. For months we have been under the impression that Iraq signed an agreement that merely allowed the inspectors back in. But this is wrong. The agreement was for Iraq to allow inspectors back and then do the inspector's job for them. By changing the perceived burden of proof, the UN is laying the groundwork for making a credible argument to the world (but in particular, the European 'street') that Hussein has not met his responsibilities under the agreement he signed. Its a lot easier to show that Iraq is 'uncooperative' or not 'pro-active' than it is to dig up evidence (sometimes quite literally) that they are still planning to develope WMD's.
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-19-2003).]
<IMG src = "http://www.sf.indymedia.org/uploads/ins_smash1.jpg">
<IMG src = "http://www.sf.indymedia.org/uploads/ins_smash2.jpg">
<IMG src = "http://www.sf.indymedia.org/uploads/ins_smash3.jpg">
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Peace activists peacefully demonstrating for peace
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-19-2003).]
<IMG src = "http://www.sf.indymedia.org/uploads/ins_smash2.jpg">
<IMG src = "http://www.sf.indymedia.org/uploads/ins_smash3.jpg">
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Peace activists peacefully demonstrating for peace
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-19-2003).]
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
As Britain prepared to announce the deployment of armoured forces to the Gulf, and large anti-war protests were held in Washington and other cities across the world, Mr Rumsfeld suggested that Saddam could avert the war by leaving the country.
"To avoid a war, I would, personally, recommend that some provision be made so that the senior leadership and their families could be provided haven in some other country," he said. "I think that would be a fair trade to avoid a war."
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/01/20/wirq20.xml&sSheet=/portal/2003/01/20/ixportaltop.html&secureRefresh=true&_requestid=37816
And why exactly are the inspectors still in iraq? Looks like its quite the foregone conclusion that they will be out of work very shortly...
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Goddamned slippery mage.
As Britain prepared to announce the deployment of armoured forces to the Gulf, and large anti-war protests were held in Washington and other cities across the world, Mr Rumsfeld suggested that Saddam could avert the war by leaving the country.
"To avoid a war, I would, personally, recommend that some provision be made so that the senior leadership and their families could be provided haven in some other country," he said. "I think that would be a fair trade to avoid a war."
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/01/20/wirq20.xml&sSheet=/portal/2003/01/20/ixportaltop.html&secureRefresh=true&_requestid=37816
And why exactly are the inspectors still in iraq? Looks like its quite the foregone conclusion that they will be out of work very shortly...
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Goddamned slippery mage.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">I want to make one thing crystal clear: opposition to the Iraqi war is not, in itself, un-American or wrong. So let's get that out of the way. If you marched yesterday, or if you supported the march yesterday, I'm not interested in your opposition to the war. I'm interested in the moral free pass you gave to known proponents of tyranny and murder.
Let's cut through the crap. Yesterday's antiwar protests were organized by International ANSWER, a virtual front organization for the Worker's World Party. The WWP, in case you didn't know, split from the old Socialist Workers Party over the 1956 Soviet invasion of Hungary. No, not to oppose it -- the WWP supported the invasion, and they've been staunch defenders of every manner of atrocity and horror in the name of socialism since. There's no moral difference between their murderous ideology and that of, say, the American Nazi Party. Both romanticize evil. Both condone tyranny.
But of course there's a social difference. Otherwise sensible, patriotic people -- people who wouldn't dream of marching for law and order with the Klan, who can't imagine signing a Nazi Party USA petition for zoning enforcement, and who think that granting an interview to Southern Partisan disqualifies a man for high office -- have no problem standing to be counted with the loathesome men and women of the WWP and International ANSWER. </font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://www.tacitus.org/archives/000327.html#000327
Interesting that there hasn't been much publicity about this controversial organization which sponsered yesterday's peace protests. I'm not surprised that the roots of the so-called 'burgeoning' peace movement is in radical communism.
http://powerline.blogspot.com/2003_01_01_powerline_archive.html#90205093
edit: At least one group in the anti-war movement has given thought about who it is they are protesting with (see link below). Although they conclude that its alright to goto an event sponsored by ANSWER, at least they are making a conscious decision. Unfortunately, most of the people who attended the protests yesterday have no idea about the group that sponsored them. The mainstream media has been derilict in its journalistic duties by omitting this crucial background information from their coverage.
http://www.gpjo.org/answer.htm
edit again: New York times says:
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/01/20/opinion/20MON2.html
uhh-huh.
Further update: The media bias aspect of this story got picked up by msnbc via glenn reynolds and from the liberal side, an almost sensible eric alterman.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/856672.asp?0cv=CB20
http://www.msnbc.com/news/752664.asp?0cv=CB20
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-20-2003).]
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-20-2003).]
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-20-2003).]
Let's cut through the crap. Yesterday's antiwar protests were organized by International ANSWER, a virtual front organization for the Worker's World Party. The WWP, in case you didn't know, split from the old Socialist Workers Party over the 1956 Soviet invasion of Hungary. No, not to oppose it -- the WWP supported the invasion, and they've been staunch defenders of every manner of atrocity and horror in the name of socialism since. There's no moral difference between their murderous ideology and that of, say, the American Nazi Party. Both romanticize evil. Both condone tyranny.
But of course there's a social difference. Otherwise sensible, patriotic people -- people who wouldn't dream of marching for law and order with the Klan, who can't imagine signing a Nazi Party USA petition for zoning enforcement, and who think that granting an interview to Southern Partisan disqualifies a man for high office -- have no problem standing to be counted with the loathesome men and women of the WWP and International ANSWER. </font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://www.tacitus.org/archives/000327.html#000327
Interesting that there hasn't been much publicity about this controversial organization which sponsered yesterday's peace protests. I'm not surprised that the roots of the so-called 'burgeoning' peace movement is in radical communism.
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Sure enough, the New York Times, like the Washington Post and the San Francisco Chronicle, acknowledges the role of A.N.S.W.E.R. as the organizer and leader of yesterday's demonstrations. It also refers to A.N.S.W.E.R.'s sister organization, the International Action Committee. But no mention of the fact that both organizations are controlled by the Workers World Party, and no mention of the openly Communist and pro-Saddam Hussein, pro-Kim il Jung ideology of A.N.S.W.E.R.'s leaders.</font>
http://powerline.blogspot.com/2003_01_01_powerline_archive.html#90205093
edit: At least one group in the anti-war movement has given thought about who it is they are protesting with (see link below). Although they conclude that its alright to goto an event sponsored by ANSWER, at least they are making a conscious decision. Unfortunately, most of the people who attended the protests yesterday have no idea about the group that sponsored them. The mainstream media has been derilict in its journalistic duties by omitting this crucial background information from their coverage.
http://www.gpjo.org/answer.htm
edit again: New York times says:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">It was impressive for the obvious mainstream roots of the marchers — from young college students to grayheads with vivid protest memories of the 60's.</font>
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/01/20/opinion/20MON2.html
uhh-huh.
Further update: The media bias aspect of this story got picked up by msnbc via glenn reynolds and from the liberal side, an almost sensible eric alterman.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/856672.asp?0cv=CB20
http://www.msnbc.com/news/752664.asp?0cv=CB20
------------------
Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-20-2003).]
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-20-2003).]
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-20-2003).]
-
Kerath
- Sojourner
- Posts: 62
- Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2001 6:01 am
- Location: Thornhill, Ontario, Canada
- Contact:
I find it interesting that 'Communism' is constantly lumped in among the greatest evils on the face of the planet. I hope, when people do this, that they are well aware of the misnomer.
The fact is, true Communism has never existed on the face of this planet. Not even close. And, to tell the truth, it probably never will. If you think it has, then go read Marx, and you'll find out that you are quite mistaken.
I don't know exactly how to classify those nations, past or present, who claim to be Communist. Defunct, half-assed Socialisms, maybe? I need a PoliSci major to help me out here
The fact is, true Communism has never existed on the face of this planet. Not even close. And, to tell the truth, it probably never will. If you think it has, then go read Marx, and you'll find out that you are quite mistaken.
I don't know exactly how to classify those nations, past or present, who claim to be Communist. Defunct, half-assed Socialisms, maybe? I need a PoliSci major to help me out here
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Kerath:
<B>I find it interesting that 'Communism' is constantly lumped in among the greatest evils on the face of the planet. I hope, when people do this, that they are well aware of the misnomer.
The fact is, true Communism has never existed on the face of this planet. Not even close. And, to tell the truth, it probably never will. If you think it has, then go read Marx, and you'll find out that you are quite mistaken.
I don't know exactly how to classify those nations, past or present, who claim to be Communist. Defunct, half-assed Socialisms, maybe? I need a PoliSci major to help me out here </B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yeah, we know. Or at least I do. However, when we're refering to these kinds of groups it's pretty safe to assume we mean "half-assed Socialists" when we say Communists. But that's what they call themselves, so who are we to argue?
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Every problem in the universe can be solved by finding the right long-haired prettyboy and beating the crap out of him.
"...it was not terribly difficult or scary unless you were a perhaps an adorable kitten and not a seasoned gamer." - Tycho, describing Panzer Dragoon Orta
<B>I find it interesting that 'Communism' is constantly lumped in among the greatest evils on the face of the planet. I hope, when people do this, that they are well aware of the misnomer.
The fact is, true Communism has never existed on the face of this planet. Not even close. And, to tell the truth, it probably never will. If you think it has, then go read Marx, and you'll find out that you are quite mistaken.
I don't know exactly how to classify those nations, past or present, who claim to be Communist. Defunct, half-assed Socialisms, maybe? I need a PoliSci major to help me out here
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Yeah, we know. Or at least I do. However, when we're refering to these kinds of groups it's pretty safe to assume we mean "half-assed Socialists" when we say Communists. But that's what they call themselves, so who are we to argue?
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Every problem in the universe can be solved by finding the right long-haired prettyboy and beating the crap out of him.
"...it was not terribly difficult or scary unless you were a perhaps an adorable kitten and not a seasoned gamer." - Tycho, describing Panzer Dragoon Orta
I'm not going to get lured into the 'true communism' debate again.. Suffice to say that groups such as ANSWER and WWP are interested in justifying regimes such as that of Milosivic in serbia and the current North Korean one. Ramsey Clark, the former attorney general turned nutjob who runs WWP has been supporting the world's most brutal dictators for almost a quarter century now. I don't really care about some esoteric debate between 'true communism' or 'false communism'. I'm merely suggesting that the mainstream media was negligent in omitting such relevant background information from their stories covering the protests. Thousands of protestors have no idea that they are attending a rally organized by the leftist equivalant of the KKK. Even prominent anti-war Liberal Eric Alterman is critical of the press at http://www.msnbc.com/news/752664.asp?0cv=CB20
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-20-2003).]
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-20-2003).]
-
Kerath
- Sojourner
- Posts: 62
- Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2001 6:01 am
- Location: Thornhill, Ontario, Canada
- Contact:
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Corth:
I'm not going to get lured into the 'true communism' debate again.. Suffice to say that groups such as ANSWER and WWP are interested in justifying regimes such as that of Milosivic in serbia and the current North Korean one. Ramsey Clark, the former attorney general turned nutjob who runs WWP has been supporting the world's most brutal dictators for almost a quarter century now. I don't really care about some esoteric debate between 'true communism' or 'false communism'. I'm merely suggesting that the mainstream media was negligent in omitting such relevant background information from their stories covering the protests. Thousands of protestors have no idea that they are attending a rally organized by the leftist equivalant of the KKK. Even prominent anti-war Liberal Eric Alterman is critical of the press at http://www.msnbc.com/news/752664.asp?0cv=CB20</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Actually, I thought it was a rather simple distinction. It either follows Communism, or it doesn't. I don't see where there's room to debate.
You aren't really the sort of person to whom such misnomers can be damaging, Corth, since you are willing to research a topic before presenting your stance. It's quite refreshing; keep up the good work.
[This message has been edited by Kerath (edited 01-20-2003).]
I'm not going to get lured into the 'true communism' debate again.. Suffice to say that groups such as ANSWER and WWP are interested in justifying regimes such as that of Milosivic in serbia and the current North Korean one. Ramsey Clark, the former attorney general turned nutjob who runs WWP has been supporting the world's most brutal dictators for almost a quarter century now. I don't really care about some esoteric debate between 'true communism' or 'false communism'. I'm merely suggesting that the mainstream media was negligent in omitting such relevant background information from their stories covering the protests. Thousands of protestors have no idea that they are attending a rally organized by the leftist equivalant of the KKK. Even prominent anti-war Liberal Eric Alterman is critical of the press at http://www.msnbc.com/news/752664.asp?0cv=CB20</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Actually, I thought it was a rather simple distinction. It either follows Communism, or it doesn't. I don't see where there's room to debate.
You aren't really the sort of person to whom such misnomers can be damaging, Corth, since you are willing to research a topic before presenting your stance. It's quite refreshing; keep up the good work.
[This message has been edited by Kerath (edited 01-20-2003).]
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
...who claim to be Communist.
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
You forgot the third option in your last post. That's where the distinction can get fuzzy.
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Every problem in the universe can be solved by finding the right long-haired prettyboy and beating the crap out of him.
"...it was not terribly difficult or scary unless you were a perhaps an adorable kitten and not a seasoned gamer." - Tycho, describing Panzer Dragoon Orta
...who claim to be Communist.
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
You forgot the third option in your last post. That's where the distinction can get fuzzy.
------------------
Every problem in the universe can be solved by finding the right long-haired prettyboy and beating the crap out of him.
"...it was not terribly difficult or scary unless you were a perhaps an adorable kitten and not a seasoned gamer." - Tycho, describing Panzer Dragoon Orta
http://usainreview.com/1_21_Security_Council.htm
Its about the oil (as far as russia and france are concerned).
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
Its about the oil (as far as russia and france are concerned).
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
Why We Know Iraq Is Lying
By CONDOLEEZZA RICE
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/01/23/opinion/23RICE.html
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Goddamned slippery mage.
By CONDOLEEZZA RICE
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/01/23/opinion/23RICE.html
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Goddamned slippery mage.
U.N. Team Still Unable to Meet Scientists Alone
Iraq Suspected of Discouraging Private Talks With Inspectors
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A35359-2003Jan23.html
----------------
This article and the previous one I linked to are good indications that the decision to goto war has already been made and is now being implemented. They are designed to pursuade US citizens that Hussein has not lived up to his side of the bargain. The emphasis is being shifted from 'the inspectors haven't found anything', to 'hussein has not cooperated with them'.
Corth
edit: More of the same from the british press: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/01/24/wrow24.xml&sSheet=/portal/2003/01/24/ixportaltop.html&secureRefresh=true&_requestid=142203
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-24-2003).]
Iraq Suspected of Discouraging Private Talks With Inspectors
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A35359-2003Jan23.html
----------------
This article and the previous one I linked to are good indications that the decision to goto war has already been made and is now being implemented. They are designed to pursuade US citizens that Hussein has not lived up to his side of the bargain. The emphasis is being shifted from 'the inspectors haven't found anything', to 'hussein has not cooperated with them'.
Corth
edit: More of the same from the british press: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/01/24/wrow24.xml&sSheet=/portal/2003/01/24/ixportaltop.html&secureRefresh=true&_requestid=142203
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Goddamned slippery mage.
[This message has been edited by Corth (edited 01-24-2003).]
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">In the second incident, occurring about 45 minutes later outside the same main entrance, a man appearing to be in his 20s ran in front of inspectors' vehicles as they left the site to begin their daily field missions to unannounced sites, witnesses said.
As he waved his arms frantically, the first two vehicles swerved around him, but the third stopped, journalists said. "Save me!" he shouted in Arabic and English, after which he was allowed to enter the vehicle. He was carrying a copybook, witnesses said.
Appearing agitated and frightened, the young man, with a closely trimmed beard and mustache, sat inside the white U.N.-marked utility vehicle for 10 minutes. At first, an inspection team leader sought help from nearby Iraqi soldiers, but the man refused to leave the vehicle as the uniformed men pulled on his sleeve and collar.
"I am unjustly treated!" he shouted.
Then U.N. security men arrived, and they and Iraqi police carried the man by his feet and arms into the fenced compound, the journalists said. Ueki said the man was turned over to Iraqi authorities at a government office adjacent to the compound. The spokesman said the man's notebook was empty, but he had no further comment on his identity or purpose.
Iraqi officials said they had no information on the incidents. </font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20030125/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq_compound_incident_12
This is how the UN treats political dissidents...
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Goddamned slippery mage.
As he waved his arms frantically, the first two vehicles swerved around him, but the third stopped, journalists said. "Save me!" he shouted in Arabic and English, after which he was allowed to enter the vehicle. He was carrying a copybook, witnesses said.
Appearing agitated and frightened, the young man, with a closely trimmed beard and mustache, sat inside the white U.N.-marked utility vehicle for 10 minutes. At first, an inspection team leader sought help from nearby Iraqi soldiers, but the man refused to leave the vehicle as the uniformed men pulled on his sleeve and collar.
"I am unjustly treated!" he shouted.
Then U.N. security men arrived, and they and Iraqi police carried the man by his feet and arms into the fenced compound, the journalists said. Ueki said the man was turned over to Iraqi authorities at a government office adjacent to the compound. The spokesman said the man's notebook was empty, but he had no further comment on his identity or purpose.
Iraqi officials said they had no information on the incidents. </font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20030125/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq_compound_incident_12
This is how the UN treats political dissidents...
------------------
Goddamned slippery mage.
Iraq to chair U.N. disarmament conference
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">At the rules-minded United Nations, it's not a country's status with international weapons inspectors, but the letters in its name which determine which member state chairs the Conference on Disarmament.
"The irony is overwhelming," a U.S. diplomat said.
Iraq will take its turn as the head of the conference, a U.N. spokesman said, because of a "purely automatic rotation by alphabetical order."
Therefore, joining Iraq as the co-chair for the May 12-June 27 session in Geneva, Switzerland, will be Iran.
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/01/28/sprj.irq.disarmament.conference/index.html
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Goddamned slippery mage.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">At the rules-minded United Nations, it's not a country's status with international weapons inspectors, but the letters in its name which determine which member state chairs the Conference on Disarmament.
"The irony is overwhelming," a U.S. diplomat said.
Iraq will take its turn as the head of the conference, a U.N. spokesman said, because of a "purely automatic rotation by alphabetical order."
Therefore, joining Iraq as the co-chair for the May 12-June 27 session in Geneva, Switzerland, will be Iran.
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/01/28/sprj.irq.disarmament.conference/index.html
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Goddamned slippery mage.
I forgot to mention... Libya was elected to chair the UN commission on human rights.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A30673-2003Jan22.html
I wonder if they can get Bin Laden to chair a committee on preventing civilian casualties from terrorism.
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Goddamned slippery mage.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A30673-2003Jan22.html
I wonder if they can get Bin Laden to chair a committee on preventing civilian casualties from terrorism.
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Goddamned slippery mage.
Not exactly reading...
http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/arafish.html
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Goddamned slippery mage.
http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/arafish.html
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Goddamned slippery mage.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Kerath:
I don't know exactly how to classify those nations, past or present, who claim to be Communist.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
One term used is "state capitalism", i.e., the state owns everything. You can get a lot of variation within that category depending on how much the head of state feels like Louis XIV ("I am the state.")
I don't know exactly how to classify those nations, past or present, who claim to be Communist.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
One term used is "state capitalism", i.e., the state owns everything. You can get a lot of variation within that category depending on how much the head of state feels like Louis XIV ("I am the state.")
The EU gets around to dealing with important issues:
http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=5413
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Goddamned slippery mage.
http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=5413
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Goddamned slippery mage.
Wow. Maybe Europe isn't a toilet after all.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-559990,00.html
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Goddamned slippery mage.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-559990,00.html
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Goddamned slippery mage.
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