Saving throws

Archive of the Sojourn3 Ideas Forum.
Yayaril
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Saving throws

Postby Yayaril » Fri Feb 14, 2003 5:01 pm

8)

Saving throws are pretty important, but unfortunately, the majority of them aren't very useful and thusly the gods give them odd abilities to make up for this. Save versus rod? I can only think of one mob in the entire game who uses a wand/staff/rod against you, and only if you're stupid. Save versus paralysis? Wasn't very useful because the mobs who paralyzed you did so without regard to this. I'm not sure if Thrym's paralyze is based on save versus paralyzation now; if it is, then great! Save versus breath and save versus spell are universally accepted as the most useful of the saving throws. You can actually see their effects in many situations. Save versus petrification/polymorph? I can think of only one mob who has a proc that 'petrifies' you and that's pretty much a paralysis proc.

The saving throw system in third edition DnD would go far as a new model for the outdated 2nd edition saving throw system that Sojourn3 employs. It splits the saves into three: fortitutde, reflex, and will. Fortitude saves affect your chances of avoiding body altering spells and abilities that can't really be dodged- like polymorph, blindness, petrification, and most death effects. Reflex represents your ability to dodge or minimize damage from affects; it works against most damage dealing spells and abilities, such as -dragons breath, area nukes, many single target nukes (lightning bolt for instance), and traps. Will saves represent your mental defenses and works against mind altering abilities, enchantments and illusionary things, such as -feeblemind, charm, dominate, fear, and silence.

Although this might not be possible to change due to extremely demonic spaghetti code that's lurking in the stratum of the mud from ancient times, if it is possible, it would make the saving throw system a much more logical and consistent thing. You would have a chance of figuring out a defense against a mob's ability without having to sit there and experiment against a potentially lethal foe. For instance, what the hell helps against psionics? Or a beholder's eyebeam? With the above outlined system, you can figure it out yourself. Mind blast could be resisted with will saves and a beholder's eyebeam could probably be dodged with a reflex save (or resisted with a fortitude save if it can't miss). Thank you for your time.
Guest

Postby Guest » Fri Feb 14, 2003 5:16 pm

All I'm going to say is just because you don't think a saving throw isn't being used doesn't mean it isn't.

The saving throws other than breath and spell are used quite often in rather insidious places and ways.

Other than that, feel free to discuss.
Yayaril
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Postby Yayaril » Fri Feb 14, 2003 6:13 pm

8)

I understand this, Kia, that's why I said: "the majority of them aren't very useful and thusly the gods give them odd abilities to make up for this. " For instance: save versus petrify is being used by a myriad of other effects that don't make sense, like to boost the effects of stoneskin. Same with save para and save rod. I'm sure there's plenty of effects that use these saves, but one can't induce that these saves would do so. It's like save versus paralyze makes you hungry less often- those are the sorts of things that the saves are being used for and it doesn't make any sense! With the new system, you'd actually be able to reason out what save you'd need to stack up in order to be more effective against a certain effect. Plus, all the saves would be useful at all times and it would require more decision making by the players as to what gear they needed. Plus, it would add interesting options for the area makers when creating gear, and the gear will actually be used. I don't think I've ever used an item with a bonus to save rod, because frankly, I have never had a mob use a rod/staff/wand on me.
Dlur
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Misinformation r00lz!

Postby Dlur » Fri Feb 14, 2003 6:13 pm

Like for example, did you know that if you have -20sv_rod you can buy iron rations from the guy on the north wall of WD for 1 copper cheaper than other people can with the same charisma value? For each point of sv_rod lower than -20 you get another copper taken off. Very Insidious indeed.
Ghimok|Dlur|Emeslan|Ili|Zinse|Teniv
*~~~~~~~~~~*
"Censorship is telling a man he can't eat a steak just because a baby can't chew it." - Mark Twain
Dlur
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sv_rod

Postby Dlur » Fri Feb 14, 2003 6:18 pm

Yayaril wrote:8)
I don't think I've ever used an item with a bonus to save rod, because frankly, I have never had a mob use a rod/staff/wand on me.


I'm pretty sure I could have used some sv_rod last time I was in MD and got "taken" by a repop while fighting a marilith and bone nagas. I think some save versus rod would have helped mightily indeed. Oh you're talking about saving throws, nevermind.
Ghimok|Dlur|Emeslan|Ili|Zinse|Teniv

*~~~~~~~~~~*

"Censorship is telling a man he can't eat a steak just because a baby can't chew it." - Mark Twain
Corth
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Postby Corth » Sat Feb 15, 2003 12:11 am

Kiaransalee wrote:All I'm going to say is just because you don't think a saving throw isn't being used doesn't mean it isn't.

The saving throws other than breath and spell are used quite often in rather insidious places and ways.

Other than that, feel free to discuss.


Would you be so kind as to tell us where these saving throws are being used?
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth

Goddamned slippery mage.

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