Gate spell

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Yayaril
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Gate spell

Postby Yayaril » Sun Jan 05, 2003 3:51 pm

How about adding Avernus as one of the places you can gate to with this spell. It's really strange that this place where all the demons and devils come from, and can easily be summoned forth into the prime plane to do another beings bidding, can't be gated in and out of. In many DnD based stories, the wizard opens up a gate to the lower or upper planes to either call up some being to help them, or to travel there for some quest. As it is now, I don't plan on ever going back to Avernus- too time intensive. Any zone that is hard to access and escape from is going to be on my no-zone list, and this inaccessability doesn't really add to the zone's flavor- just makes it annoying

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rylan
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Postby rylan » Sun Jan 05, 2003 7:06 pm

I wouldn't mind seeing it gatable like you said, but I think gating out from avernus should still be blocked. Dunno if thats possible to code a one-way gate area tho.
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Postby Dalar » Sun Jan 05, 2003 9:34 pm

i like the fact that avernus is !teleport. to me it makes BC the end game zone instead of another clouds zone.

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Postby Nilan » Mon Jan 06, 2003 7:25 am

Its very challenging and fun as it is.

Keep it same Image

Nilan
Yayaril
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Postby Yayaril » Mon Jan 06, 2003 12:55 pm

It's challenging not because it's not gateable. If it was gateable, it'd still be challenging- you just wouldn't have to sit on your duff in res fx quite so much. Plus, if people had to go, in an emergency, then it wouldn't be such a big deal. As is, I don't think I'll have enough spare time to ever do Avernus or Bronze Citadel- too time intensive. If you could gate in and out, that'd be a different story. I guess this zone will just remain on my no-list until something happens to make it more fun. Right now, it's a drag.

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Postby thanuk » Mon Jan 06, 2003 4:48 pm

I think the !tele in avernus is a very important aspect of its difficulty. I do however, dislike the means of escape. Rather than having just a 1 shot deal to get out, would there really be a problem with a 1 way portal that is always there? Maybe you still have to earn the exit but it doesn't dissappear after a time duration? I think being able to gate people IN to avernus would make it a great deal easier, however i think making it just a little bit easier for people to get OUT of avernus wouldn't really be such a drastic change. If the portal didn't disappear, then you could have just 1 person leave in the middle without screwing everyone else, and nobody would get stranded there for weeks, which totally sucks.

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Postby Dalar » Mon Jan 06, 2003 6:38 pm

why is gating into avernus make it even easier? all you gotta do is get one person to run to ribcage (oooo HARD!), then a couple of fights then you're in avernus. i agree w/ thanuk though. make carmichael's portal last longer so the afk people don't complain about no arena portal in Avernus.

if avernus was gateable it would mean groups could easily avoid the hag and pickup squad. having the whole zone !teleport imho lets the area gods make the rewards much better.

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Postby Corth » Mon Jan 06, 2003 7:49 pm

Btw, arena portal in avernus is such a great idea... I suggest putting one at the entrance to roots and the first magic room in roots as well... Image

Corth

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Jegzed
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Postby Jegzed » Mon Jan 06, 2003 8:23 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Corth:
Btw, arena portal in avernus is such a great idea... </font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I can think of several ways to use this to twink Image



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Ensis
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Postby Ensis » Mon Jan 06, 2003 11:24 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Dalar:
<B>if avernus was gateable it would mean groups could easily avoid the hag and pickup squad. having the whole zone !teleport imho lets the area gods make the rewards much better.

</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

(puts on the dumbass hat)

i thought the only reward there was a dagger?



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Postby Jegzed » Mon Jan 06, 2003 11:39 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Ensis:
<B> (puts on the dumbass hat)

i thought the only reward there was a dagger?

</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

noob.

Avernus have several of the most sought after pieces of equipment in the game.
And thats not even counting the loot from Bronze Citadel, where the dagger is not even the best item.



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rylan
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Postby rylan » Tue Jan 07, 2003 12:24 am

nod jezged, the twink possibilities are too huge with an arena portal.
Yayaril
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Postby Yayaril » Tue Jan 07, 2003 2:16 am

The group suffered a total wipe out on several occasions (except rogues) and easily made it back to Bronze Citadel without any deaths. The difference between having the zone gateable and not gateable would be 15 minutes of waiting when the whole group gets wiped out. The difference between having the zone gateable and not gateable would be about 15 minutes each time a person got killed (gate in and loot). The zone is still challenging, but there would be a lot less waiting and more actual zoning. The fights are tough and people will die- without the sitting around and waiting for res fx portion of the zone, the time required would drop substantially- then people could just preserve the corpses and res at their leisure at a later point, when they can't find a zone group.

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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Tue Jan 07, 2003 6:25 am

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Yayaril:
<B>The group suffered a total wipe out on several occasions (except rogues) and easily made it back to Bronze Citadel without any deaths. The difference between having the zone gateable and not gateable would be 15 minutes of waiting when the whole group gets wiped out. The difference between having the zone gateable and not gateable would be about 15 minutes each time a person got killed (gate in and loot). The zone is still challenging, but there would be a lot less waiting and more actual zoning. The fights are tough and people will die- without the sitting around and waiting for res fx portion of the zone, the time required would drop substantially- then people could just preserve the corpses and res at their leisure at a later point, when they can't find a zone group.

</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Easy solve to everyones problems. Don't die. Good nuff!

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Postby Corth » Tue Jan 07, 2003 7:17 am

Believe it or not, i've noticed that telling my group not to die actually works very well. I believe that on more than one occasion ive gotten a group spanked solely because i forgot to tell my followers to stay alive under all circumstances. You would think that such a command would be unneccessary. Image

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thanuk
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Postby thanuk » Tue Jan 07, 2003 2:55 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Yayaril:
<B>The group suffered a total wipe out on several occasions (except rogues) and easily made it back to Bronze Citadel without any deaths. The difference between having the zone gateable and not gateable would be 15 minutes of waiting when the whole group gets wiped out. The difference between having the zone gateable and not gateable would be about 15 minutes each time a person got killed (gate in and loot). The zone is still challenging, but there would be a lot less waiting and more actual zoning. The fights are tough and people will die- without the sitting around and waiting for res fx portion of the zone, the time required would drop substantially- then people could just preserve the corpses and res at their leisure at a later point, when they can't find a zone group.

</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
If it was gateable you would never die at all. As soon as shit went sour you could send a mage 1 room away to open a gate, you all run out except the rogue who hides, remem, respell, and hop right back in. Insanely twinkable if its gateable because it won't pop with someone in the zone.




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Thanuk Pantherclaw

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Yayaril
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Postby Yayaril » Tue Jan 07, 2003 6:30 pm

Actually Thanuk- the parts of Bronze citadel that pop, will pop whether you're in the zone or not. The parts that don't pop- don't pop whether people are in the zone or not. So your argument is unbased.

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thanuk
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Postby thanuk » Tue Jan 07, 2003 7:35 pm

Uhm, we are talking about all of avernus, not just the bronze citadel. Either way, my argument makes perfect sense. The rogue stays and runs to safety so the group can be gated in again, and you have superior twinkiness, eliminating the "do or die" atmosphere that currently prevails in avernus.



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Thanuk Pantherclaw

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Yayaril
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Postby Yayaril » Wed Jan 08, 2003 4:50 am

Umm, as it is now- the rogue runs off and waits for the group to just walk in, as opposed to gating. Notice how one method requires 15 minutes, and the other requires like 2 minutes? All I want, is to save people time. Bronze citadel can stay as hard as it is now, but let's filter out all that waiting around- that's all I want.

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thanuk
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Postby thanuk » Wed Jan 08, 2003 7:07 pm

No i see your point, im just trying to say that if you allowed people to gate in and out of avernus and BC it would get abused heavily, because the whole design of the zone is based around the fact that its !teleport. If you could gate in after deaths, you wouldnt have died in the first place, because you could gate out to smoke, regroup, gate back in and finish the fight you started. Its really not so bad the way it is. Everyone getting together after a spank rather than going afk, and pressing corpses instead of ressing will save you alot more time than being able to gate back into the garden will.


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Thanuk Pantherclaw

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Sylvos
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Postby Sylvos » Wed Jan 08, 2003 11:05 pm

Having the key to enable you to get back into avernus taken does delay CR'ing by LOTS however...

*mutter*
Yayaril
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Postby Yayaril » Thu Jan 09, 2003 3:22 am

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by thanuk:
<B>No i see your point, im just trying to say that if you allowed people to gate in and out of avernus and BC it would get abused heavily, because the whole design of the zone is based around the fact that its !teleport. If you could gate in after deaths, you wouldnt have died in the first place, because you could gate out to smoke, regroup, gate back in and finish the fight you started. Its really not so bad the way it is. Everyone getting together after a spank rather than going afk, and pressing corpses instead of ressing will save you alot more time than being able to gate back into the garden will.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Why would being able to gate back in, summon the person up, and then pressing their corpse and looting take more time than ressing them and having them sit there for 15 minutes while res effects wear off?

Why would the gating ability be abused? The !teleport aspect of Avernus just makes it take longer, but doesn't really add any more challenge to it. It's more of an annoyance factor than a challenge.

I can see folks fleeing from tracking fights in Avernus onto smoke. In that aspect, it would save a couple people from dying. On the other hand, before people start fleeing, the majority of the group is usually spanked. However, when it comes to bronze citadel- (which would probably be !gate if this change went into affect) it wouldn't make any difference, most of the fights in there don't have tracking mobs. Once you get in deeper- even if the mobs track, there's no place to run to. This zone just is too time intensive, and it's the !teleport that causes this.

Imagine changing the vault in Swamp of Meilech to be !teleport. Instead of welling dead folks back in to loot up and continue the fight, you'd have to res everyone back in. This means that each time you died, you'd be sitting there for 15 minutes, waiting. Would this make the vault more challenging? No. Would this make the vault simply take longer? Yes. The mobs don't heal anyway, so it's not like getting those people back in faster causes the battle to be won. Same with Bronze Citadel.



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Bipple
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Postby Bipple » Thu Jan 09, 2003 7:30 am

Hmm how to abuse gate... have an Illu sneak past the first two rings of mobs and gate the group off smoke right to 1S of gate house
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Postby Xisiqomelir » Thu Jan 09, 2003 7:56 am

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Bipple:
Hmm how to abuse gate... have an Illu sneak past the first two rings of mobs and gate the group off smoke right to 1S of gate house</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not to mention having that same illu able to check rares solo every boot, too.

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Yayaril
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Postby Yayaril » Thu Jan 09, 2003 12:47 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Bipple:
Hmm how to abuse gate... have an Illu sneak past the first two rings of mobs and gate the group off smoke right to 1S of gate house</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Maybe you didn't read my previous responses and jumped right into the thread, read the last post, and decided to respond. If that's the case, then I'll point you back to one of my posts that said make Bronze Citadel not gateable if this change gets made.



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