State of the online gaming union...

Archived discussion from Toril-2.
Gerad
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State of the online gaming union...

Postby Gerad » Sun Dec 14, 2003 1:03 am

Please note that this is my personal opinion... im not attacking anyone so please dont take these as insults, its just the way I feel about these games...

Ok, so here I go again, looking for a game to play, having beating the ever living crap out of vice city.

Torilmud: Played for like 10 years, now its kinda old... will always love mudding but Im on semi permanent leave. Speaks good for a game that it owned all for 10 years tho.

Final Fantasy Online: Bored me to tears, besides, SIX GIGS?!?!

Star wars galaxies: Cool for a month, then I got sick of running everywhere and grinding useless skills that nobody appreciated.

Planetside: When it first came out, this was better than HALO. Then they ruined it. Core combat is terribly unballanced and the cheating and lag are unbearable. Besides, my outfit all left for final fantasy online.

Counterstrike/Half-Life/Team Fortress Classic: Been there, done that, hate the AWP.

Earth and Beyond: Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha. Cool for 10 minutes. They have a really cool world that they constructed, its too bad that the gameplay is so one dimensional. Might as well be an 8 bit nintendo card with nice graphics.

A Tale in the Desert: Once the novelty wears off, its a run around and grind fest. Nobody roleplays which is the only thing that could save it.

Everquest: Swore I never would and I wont start now.

HALO: I tagged newbies with plasma grenades as I floated like a god around their shots. I sniped pros like bishes, I mastered the 3 shot pistol kill, and I scored probably 15 thousand kills on gamespy. Now I am done, it actually makes me ill to play this game for more than 10 minutes now. Its a good game, I just ruined it for myself by playing it too much.

And the matrix online doesnt come out until like, summer.

So whats an online gamer to do? What am I missing? Does anyone have any suggestions? What games did you really like, and what games do you think I am missing out on?

-Gerad
<I>When a man lies, he murders some part of the world
These are the pale deaths, which men miscall their lives
All this I cannot bear to witness any longer
Cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home?</I>
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Sun Dec 14, 2003 1:05 am

Best advice -
Screw the new stuff, and new systems. Go to a gamestop store or something like it, and purchase an old system like an SNES, and hit the old games bin and pickup a bunch. Classics are way more fun than alot of the new stuff out there. Pretty much all mmorpg types or must mmo games in general tend to be one dimensional after you get past the fancy shell.
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Postby Gerad » Sun Dec 14, 2003 1:14 am

Arilin, thats great advice, in fact, I did that about 2 years ago when I didnt have any money. I went out and bought a playstation 1 and the games were only like 10 bucks at gamestop for almost every game.
I played like every resident evil, and discovered an awesome series, Dino Crisis! Went back and played all the old final fantasy games too.

I also used to have a SNES and an 8 bit NES with tons of games, I played those up until I was about 17 (23 now)...

So yeah, I agree 100%, that is great advice but Ive been there :)

-G
<I>When a man lies, he murders some part of the world

These are the pale deaths, which men miscall their lives

All this I cannot bear to witness any longer

Cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home?</I>
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Sun Dec 14, 2003 1:32 am

Hmm.. well current advice for an mmo fan. I have no clue. :P Uh, get the new mario kart game and stomp dartan? :P
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Postby Teyaha » Sun Dec 14, 2003 2:38 am

you didnt mention dark age of camelot.

they just put out a new expansion pack. it's a great game.
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Sun Dec 14, 2003 2:41 am

same crap he mentioned though. It's like any mmo game out there :P You do the same crap over and over.
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Postby Sarvis » Sun Dec 14, 2003 3:01 am

Which is different from MUDding how? ;)

Neverwinter Nights is cool, the original campaign wasn't that great really but the two expansions are awesome. Plus the online community makes tons of modules which have kept it interesting since I got the game last February.

There's also a variety of persistant worlds that you could check out if you really wanna get into the multiplayer aspect (I've never tried one.) Best part is that they are basically free MMORPGS, and each one puts in it's own custom scripts and stuff in so they are all different in various ways.


There's also a Korean game called Gunbound running around right now. It's kind of a rip off of Worms, but it's fun and online and currently free since they are beta testing it. The downside is balance problems and immature players, but I assume that's a given with just about any online game... heh.
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Postby Tanji Smanji » Sun Dec 14, 2003 4:39 am

Playing Anarchy-Online myself, by no means perfect but its entertaining and I know I can quit whenever I want. Plus you can solo with most anything if you don't feel like grouping or have time.
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Postby Wobb » Sun Dec 14, 2003 7:27 am

wolfenstein, enemy territory

due to poorly planned licensing....they released this game completely for free. Its a first person shooter, but with objectives set in WWII, you play an engineer, medic, covert ops, field ops, or soldier. What sets it apart from other FPS is that you gain skills in certain areas.

It's a great game, check it out...go to www.3dgamers.com and go to action games, then look for Wolfenstein 3d, enemy territory.

Good luck
Wobb
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Postby Ragorn » Sun Dec 14, 2003 7:39 am

Give Earth and Beyond a second look, it's more complex than you think. The multi-faceted experience gain is completely unlike playing traditional MMOGs, where the only way to advance is to slog through thousands of mobs. The galaxy is open for you to explore, there are very few aggro-all sectors to spell instant death. The class selection is small but robust; there are no crappy, ineffective, rangeresque classes. Anything you pick will be useful throughout the game.

Plus, E&B has the only working player-driven economy in all of MMOG world. Crafting is both useful and beneficial. Money in the game has a definite purpose.

But, if you absolutely must hack and slash, try DAoC. Of all the Everclones, I've heard the best things from it. I played Anarchy Online and quit, the game was identical to Everquest with different names for things. FFXI and Planetside are both garbage, yes. From the looks of things, WoW will just be another EverClone.

I'm holding off for something PvP I think. I'll check out whatever Sigil puts out for sure, just because of the enormous talent on their team. Beyond that, I'm really not looking at any MMOG in particular to hold my interest. My only currently active subscription is to Earth and Beyond.
- Ragorn
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Postby Gromikazer » Sun Dec 14, 2003 9:53 am

I played Earth and beyond during beta, and then quit. I revisited it a few months back... (April->July) and I found there are alot of aspects to it that I remembered that are fun. I do recommend earth and beyond for playing, but truthfully it's ability to keep active interest from me was only 3-4 months long. The problem is it like all Mmogs have the same problem. Everyone wants the same good items so when the gate loads (think zone poping) there are 60 people there wanting to kill the same 4-5 boss mobs, to get the same 6-8 pieces of equipment. (There are more epics, and there are plenty of quests) I had fun with Earth and beyond.

I am currently waiting for WoW, but it is likely I will end up playing EQ2, because that is what all my friends will likely be playing. I have high hopes for WoW, because of blizzards solid record of putting out robust packages of content, which is what I'm looking for to keep me busy.

I don't know if your into RTS games, but a current popular game that has been doing fairly well is Age of Mythology: The titans. The game is really fun with a few friends, although not nearly as fun by yourself.

A big problem is alot of the games coming out right now, aren't of too great quality. It's as if the gaming companies are trying to beat piracy by producing games no one wants to rip off. That is unfortunate for the average consumer, but hopefully there will be some good games on the horizon.
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Postby Kifle » Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:18 pm

I suggest Rainbow6:3 online. That game has been like crack for me, and I'll be willing to bet 100 bucks that you wont be as good as you are in halo with it at first. It's a lot of strategy and very well placed headshots using guns with realistic recoil instead of an assault rifle with !recoil a la halo.

I myself have been switching from playing that, ghost recon, splinter cell, and the FF series on my computer.
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Postby Teyaha » Sun Dec 14, 2003 8:36 pm

Arilin Nydelahar wrote:same crap he mentioned though. It's like any mmo game out there :P You do the same crap over and over.


not really.

you dont lose levels when you die.

shitload of classes...it's amazing how many there are.

really robust quests.

killer graphics, and they run great on most computers.

dont forget the pvp...i never supported pvp on amud because it was always so chaotic and ended up with people camping your spawn points. not quit the same here as it's realm vs. realm.

fuck..you gonna make me play again..feh
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Postby Tasan » Sun Dec 14, 2003 9:31 pm

Splinter Cell? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAH.

Worst waste of time ever.

T
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Sun Dec 14, 2003 10:29 pm

Earth and Beyond is actually a pretty fun game. I played it pretty hard for about three months, considering getting my subscription again. It can get old, but if you got a group of friends who play it's fairly fun.
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Postby Ragorn » Sun Dec 14, 2003 11:38 pm

Yeah my big problem with E&B is the lack of any real central area where people hang out. It's really hard to find a group of any type if you aren't guilded and don't know anyone else playing. The best you can do is go to Net-7 and shout for a group or try to find a good exp zone and join a group there.

On the plus side, they release new content through free patches, not $30 expansion packs.
- Ragorn
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Sun Dec 14, 2003 11:40 pm

What'd you play rags? I had a few chars I actually liked I should pickup again eventually.
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Postby Ragorn » Mon Dec 15, 2003 1:43 am

I had a Terran Trader and a Terran Enforcer, both on Orion. I prefer Terrans since I'm very impatient, and I could never handle flying around the galaxy at 2750 warp like Progen do :( My Roadrunner device and Kraken reactor are the only things that keep me sane when flying through sectors.

I always sorta wanted to try JE, but their total lack of combat ability really isn't my thing.
- Ragorn
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Mon Dec 15, 2003 1:47 am

Ragorn wrote:I had a Terran Trader and a Terran Enforcer, both on Orion. I prefer Terrans since I'm very impatient, and I could never handle flying around the galaxy at 2750 warp like Progen do :( My Roadrunner device and Kraken reactor are the only things that keep me sane when flying through sectors.

I always sorta wanted to try JE, but their total lack of combat ability really isn't my thing.


Yeah, I played Orion as well. Feh, making me want to play it again. Though I did love my TT's warp. I still liked my PW ability to just blow the crap out of things. I should re-activate my account, hurm. You still actively play?
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Postby Ambar » Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:25 am

Arilin Nydelahar wrote:Yeah, I played Orion as well. Feh, making me want to play it again. Though I did love my TT's warp. I still liked my PW ability to just blow the crap out of things. I should re-activate my account, hurm. You still actively play?


I refuse to spend more money to re-activate my account :P Had two chars and dont even remember what they were ... was fun tho ... different yet similar
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:36 am

I wouldn't ask you to play anyway, I'd have to like you. :P
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Postby Ambar » Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:37 am

There is that ........
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Postby Gerad » Mon Dec 15, 2003 9:53 am

For the about a month that I played earth and beyond I was a Jenquai Defender.

Do they still have a free trial? Im ganna go look. Might try it again.
Last time I played was RIGHT after it came out.
<I>When a man lies, he murders some part of the world

These are the pale deaths, which men miscall their lives

All this I cannot bear to witness any longer

Cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home?</I>
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Postby Ragorn » Mon Dec 15, 2003 10:05 am

I have an active account, but my guild disbanded out of nowhere so I'm kind of in limbo at the moment. Terran Enforcers have plenty of destructive power, triple missile launchers and a good reactor put mobs down pretty quick.

Yeah they still do the free trial.
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Games..

Postby Joras » Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:02 pm

Well, you really aren't looking all that hard for new content.. Since what you stated was only 6-7 titles.. and you refused to try one of the best games ever in Everquest.

1. Everquest -- Although it's not as fun to start now as it was in the beginning, yes less bugs and better graphics but they have made it to easy. There isn't enough challenge for me anymore, even as a noob.

2. Horizons -- Yes, another "EverClone" or a better name for all these would be another "FantasyClone" It's got the best Crafting system out period end of story. It's Everquest meets UO when it comes to crafting, and has more options by three times then DAoC. Young game, needs patches etc.. But again.. Learning the game in the beginning is most of the fun.

3. DAoC -- New Expansion came out, looks good. This game is much more PvP driven, if your into that more. Although I guess it's "Just another EverClone treadmill leveling game" I don't even know why people even try them if they go into it with that attitude.

4. Shadowbane -- Best PvP in an online game made yet, Except maybe old school UO..(Without the cheats)... But again Wolfpack was unable to control their programmers and there are horrid problems with Shadowbane, or at least there were at the time I left. (When my whole server was hacked by WolfPack employees

Ok, enough MMOs You seemed to like first person shooters..

1. Metal of Honor (Plus all the add-ons) My favorite first person shooter. Although I'm not a big FPS fan.. But I thought the usage of historical sites, and WWII vintage weapons and vehicles was awesome. Online play is great as well, and free. Pick a well run server and your cheat free, and can play 24.7 with as many as 60 people at a time (Which is a good number for MOHAA's maps.)

2. Doom's, Unreal's, [Insert any other of the 100000000 FPS titles]

RTS Games.. Now here is some fun..

1. Age of Empires 2 Expansion. -- The best RTS period. The don't screw around with 3D, something a RTS does NOT need... Blizzard is a GREAT company.. but in WC3 they blew chunks! Same with Sony and Lords of Everquest.

2. Rise of Nations -- It's got a little bit of the 3D feel but not enough to ruin the game play, and you have many many more game settings to fool around with game play. It also goes much farther into the modern day then AoE2 (Something I don't like) but you can set that as well.

RP Games...

1. Neverwinter Nights. -- Just a great game. Play single player game, Multiplayer with friends, Multiplayer with a persistant game, a Mod made by a random person on the net.. etc. Create your own game.. Be the DM.. Just a great game, that will be hard to beat for sometime to come.

2. Diablo2LoD Patch 1.10 -- An oldy but a goody.. Blizzard said they would never add on to D2x but with Patch 1.10 they really did. They added more items, added ladder only play and fixed BNet, with what they called a "Rust Storm" which nuked all the old dupes. I have a running game of D2x on the ladder with 3 other people, it's great. Nice to replay an old game and get just as much enjoyment out of it as you did in the begining.

3. Wizardy 8 -- One of the best RPG's made (Wizardy 7 was almost as good) Multi-starts and finishes.. Great writing, and game play.. Tons of party options etc.. Quests are well thought out. Great game.

I could go on probably for days on RPG's.. Depends on what you like and how old you go back.. I started with Wizardy1 and the Overlord... so I've seen them all pretty much.. I even played Rogue back in the day...

UFO Defence, Terror of the Deep, Darklands, CiV1,2,3+, Castle Wolfenstien, Might&Magic 1,2,3,4,5,6,7 (One and Two were insane), Doom2(One of the only FPS with true CoOp)

Playstation2 -- Gladius Great game if you like strat games. You run a glaidator school, good story, great game play.. It's the only console game I can even recomend. But it's very good.

Welp I think thats enough.. Should be a game for anyone in there. Plus I've probably missed a 100 more good titles.

Joras
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Postby moritheil » Mon Dec 15, 2003 6:44 pm

<h2> In Nomine. </h2>

Come on now, you should have been expecting this ;)

In terms of cRPGs, try Champions of Krynn/Death Knights of Krynn/Dark Queen of Krynn. The only problem is that once you get the hang of the system, battles are all too easy (hmm, let's see, this boss is a dragon, I think I'll just poke him with my dragonlance-wielding knight with 115 hps... oh look, one-hit kill. Yawn.) However, at least the storyline up through the end of DKK is a major one for the DragonLance line, and explains how Soth wound up in RavenLoft.

If you like NES/SNES but don't want to play the same games over and over, I recommend BS Zelda. This game is like a Zelda 1 remix. It's actually a super famicom game, but you should be able to dig one up on emulator. It's legal since it was never released in the US, and only briefly released in Japan, and thus impossible to buy.
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Postby Ragorn » Mon Dec 15, 2003 8:06 pm

Horizons is the biggest pile of useless code to hit the market since Anarchy Online's beta release. In fact, several people who beta tested AO and Horizons have said that Horizons is actually the worst MMORPG they've played to date. I've heard entirely mixed reviews about the crafting system, this thread is the first one where anyone ever had a really strongly positive reaction to it. Horizons is an incomplete game, a game pushed out the door by marketing before the coders were done with it. Let me quote a few reactions from people on other boards:

"The game is currently a skeleton, and maybe not even that. They have a lot of great ideas and systems implemented in the game, but the meat isn't there. Several classes hardly vary from one to the next and many weren't even implemented fully by release. A lot of the content isn't there. The largest city in the game (Tazoon) had a trainer in like 5% of their buildings and nothing else. Felt dead."

"I beta horizons. It is the worst MMOG I have played to date, and I played AO through its horrible beta and into its lousy release. I would rather watch paint dry then play Horizons."

Here is a thread on the Tazoon.com boards where users relate their horrible billing mishap stories: http://www.tazoon.com/releaseForums/tm.asp?m=19325

"Looks like things are just as crappy as they were in BETA. I wouldn't tell my worst enemy to play Horizons."


Go ahead and make your own decision about the game, but so far I've really never heard anything strongly positive about the game before right now. In an ocean of choices, there's no reason to spend money on the little fish. Go with Everquest, DAoC, E&B, or FFXI if that's your thing. Most of the other titles out there are either EverClones, or buggy sacks of crap (Shadowbane, Eve...). If you're going to play an EverClone, may as well play EQ :)
- Ragorn
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Postby Gromikazer » Mon Dec 15, 2003 9:27 pm

I played a TW to 147th level, and had several other 60th level characters.

At about 120th level or so any race can cap out at 5k warp, it just happens and without too much trouble. In the end while missiles can be powerful, JD (Jenquai Defenders) beams, and PW (Progen Warriors) projectiles ended up being more powerful, and they had much more significant skill selections that helped them out more. It did nothing but make me upset that terrans were best at missiles which i had a 8k range, but all thier skills had a 3k range. It made it sorta pointless.

I completed more then a few epics and I had alot fun while I played, but when my friends stopped playing I found less and less interest in it, just like most MMorpgs I've played.

I played on the galileo server.
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Games dont make people violent, lag does.
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Postby Ragorn » Mon Dec 15, 2003 10:04 pm

I like the TE for his ability to hunt solo. Kiting mobs is fairly painless, and Rally is excellent for providing defense and critical strike. The Terran speed enhancing devices make kiting easier, having a mobile speed of 300-400 at level 60 makes soloing most mobs a matter of time.

For those who are interested, here is a graph and an article about current MMORPG subscriber rates:

http://pw1.netcom.com/~sirbruce/Subscriptions.html

VERY interesting reading.
- Ragorn
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