Guess what?

Archived discussion from Toril-2.
kwirl
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Guess what?

Postby kwirl » Wed Sep 14, 2005 2:32 pm

Well, my lawyers just finished with the insurance company, and are going to give me a check, after all expenses and fees, of 36,000$.

I'm buying a new car, and the rest is going towards a down payment on a new home. Maybe.

This accident has changed me in so many ways, and not just by increasing my tolerance for pain. I've become forced to mature in a lot of ways, and it has oddly enough given me opportunities for things that I would not otherwise have the option to consider.

I recently learned that in California, you can purchase a home with no money down, as long as you have a good credit score and are a first-time homeowner (my friend got a 2 bedroom/2 bath condo in San Diego).

So, California is seriously on my to-do list now. I am also considering taking legal action against Toyota, although the RAV4 is somehow considered one of the safest SUV's out there.

My lawyers are looking into the possibility of taking action regarding the SUV, but it doesn't look good. (the vehicle was destroyed days after the accident, and all I have are some pictures taken the next day showing how fucked up it was)

Anyway, thats the story, thought I'd drop a line
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Postby Vaprak » Wed Sep 14, 2005 3:06 pm

You can purchase a home in most states no money down if you have a good credit score and a job. There are lots of programs available for this including RA loans (need to be first time home buyer, I believe this stands for Rural Administration or something like that). There are also various programs available through different lenders if you look around, but you have to be careful with those.

The RA loan is nice because not only is it 0% down, it also doesn't require you to purchase Private Mortgage Insurance, which can really add up on your monthly payment. I did an RA loan on my house and I just pay a pile extra each month. Works great!

Besides, with any luck California will fall off the earth into the ocean before too long. Who'd want a house there. If you want ocean front property, buy Arizona. See you down in Arizona Bay!
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Postby Dalar » Wed Sep 14, 2005 4:15 pm

Now the question is, how do you get a good credit score!
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.
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Postby Corth » Wed Sep 14, 2005 4:35 pm

Buying property no money down in the midst of a housing bubble... in California of all places. Good luck to you my friend. Just remember the foreclosure attorney is just doing his job.
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth

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Postby Llaaldara » Wed Sep 14, 2005 4:53 pm

Dalar wrote:Now the question is, how do you get a good credit score!


Online Auto-Pay
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Postby Dalar » Wed Sep 14, 2005 5:43 pm

Llaaldara wrote:
Dalar wrote:Now the question is, how do you get a good credit score!


Online Auto-Pay

-_-
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Postby Tanji Smanji » Wed Sep 14, 2005 11:39 pm

Corth wrote:Buying property no money down in the midst of a housing bubble... in California of all places. Good luck to you my friend. Just remember the foreclosure attorney is just doing his job.



Glad to see I wasn't the only one thinking that.
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Postby sok » Thu Sep 15, 2005 2:55 am

california continue to grow, it's crazy. last oct, i bought a 2/2 condo 295k, it now worth 375k. the bad new is my mortage is about 2k/month. i only make 3k/month, so it's tough. i'm still a little surprised cuz i thought there no way it could be worth anymore. so investing in calornia is never a bad deal, but just know u are getting your money's worth.

my suggestion, is continue to rent. buy a house in vegas (which is going up like crazy) or azirona, texas, anywhere else. pay the 3-6% to property management, and rent the house out. my friend is doing this, he's building duplexes in indiana. it's amazing how cheap houses are outside california.
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Postby Corth » Thu Sep 15, 2005 3:27 am

California real estate has appreciated at a much faster rate than anywhere else. That does not bode well when the real estate bubble pops. And it is a bubble. The price of real estate MUST have a relation to income. Sok's house has appreciated over 20% in one year. I don't see income moving at anywhere near that rate. This type of appreciation is indicative of a speculative bubble.

Most of my rl job experience is real estate related. I used to represent banks at real estate closings. Often 3 or 4 a day. I probably have been to over 1000 of them. My conclusion is based upon some serious studying of the industry. However, don't take my word on it. Daz, if you are seriously considering that type of investment, you should do some serious research.

Furthermore, though you say that you have matured, I see the exact opposite here Daz. You got hurt, and now you are getting a nice cash windfall. The first thing you are going to do is blow it on a brand new car. A depreciating asset that will lose most of its value in the first couple of years. At the same time, you are talking about purchasing a house NO MONEY DOWN. If you decide that you should buy a house, which I STRONGLY recommend not doing, then why not apply that money towards a down payment and buy a used Civic in good condition?

IMHO, you have a good opportunity here Daz, and you should think very carefully about what you are going to do with it. I am assuming, based on your injuries, that you are not likely to be doing much physical labor anytime soon. I don't know what type of work experience you have, and what your job prospects are in California or wherever you end up. That money could be saved towards starting or purchasing a business that will allow you to make a lot more money. Now its not my money, and your going to do with it what you want, but the mature thing would not be to blow it on a brand new car, unless you already have much more than 35k in liquid assets (which I am assuming you don't, because you need to buy your house without putting anything down).

More advice. Goto fatwallet.com and get very well acquainted with their finance forum.

Corth
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Postby Jhorr » Thu Sep 15, 2005 10:37 am

Good advice Corth. How though does one know when it is safe again to purchase a house?
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Postby Glarec » Thu Sep 15, 2005 1:46 pm

too early in the morning. ignore this
Last edited by Glarec on Thu Sep 15, 2005 2:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Corth » Thu Sep 15, 2005 2:28 pm

Jhorr:

Hard to tell really. I expect that the time to buy will be when people no longer are buying houses with the expecation that they will appreciate rapidly, but rather because they just need a place to live. When you see a lot of out of work real estate industry people. Former day traders turned mortgage brokers jumping on the next bandwagon. That will be the time to buy.

Corth
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Postby avak » Thu Sep 15, 2005 5:05 pm

Yeah, great advice Corth. Here are a few links...there is a -ton- of evidence supporting the housing bubble's imminent collapse, even down to where it will happen first *cough* cali *cough*

A graph of the national housing price index over the last 100+ yrs:
http://business2.blogs.com/.shared/image.html?/photos/uncategorized/21realgraphic.gif

Another graph with more metrics:
http://bigpicture.typepad.com/.shared/image.html?/photos/uncategorized/barrons_shiller_206172005223742.gif

The NYT article the graph came from for context and really good background info:
http://www.libertypost.org/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=106291

That being said, houses can still be an awesome investment, imo. I know it was the smartest thing I ever did with my money...5% down, super low rate...but I plan to live in my house long past the last payment.

Good luck with whatever you do with the cash Daz. More than likely its a small concession for the suffering
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Postby sok » Thu Sep 15, 2005 9:59 pm

i agree with corth that you definately want to think long and hard about buying in california. But i think this is not a bad time to buy a house, with interest rates being so low.

if i had to do all over again, i wouldn't bought a house here. i would rent in california.i would use my money and buy duplex or a house in some other state. get a propery management company and rent the house. my friends, just bought a 3bed/2 bath house in indiana in a bad neighborhood for 13k. the mortage and property management fees on that has got to be between $150-200, plus $300 for home warrenty. if they rent the house for 400 a month, which is a steal they are still profit $2100 a year.

austin is another great place to buy. vegas, arizona, alt, basically anywhere but california, new york, boston, or the major market.
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Postby kiryan » Fri Sep 16, 2005 3:53 am

WHY

Low interest rates means people can pay higher prices and thats why we have a housing bubble.

Its ike this... if you can borrow 100k at 15% interest rate and the monthly is 1,000 a month when interest rates go down to 5% you might be able to borrow 300k and still pay 1,000 a month. Thats where the house prices inflated, people could suddenly buy a lot more on the same monthly and did so for no good reason except someone else did it.

I disagree with Corth slightly in that I think the housing market in So Cal was grossly undervalued... Its probably overvalued right now, but I'm not sure by how much.

The reason is the jobs, lots of well paying jobs can be found in Los Angeles and those people can afford expensive houses. Also, with dual income families being the rule average household wages increased even more. I think the So Cal market needed a correction, 5 years ago a friend of mine bought a 1800 sqft house for 240k and was making 130k a year. Today, most of the people I know still make 80k or more a year... to them buying a 300k house is affordable especially if they have a dual income.

On the other hand, home prices in Flagstaff Arizona have increased about 100% in 5 years and are at the 250k range while average wages have risen to $8.50 an hour. Jobs can't justify the increase in price. I blame the increase here partly on the growth of phoenix resulting in more second homes/vacation homes, partly on speculation, and largely on interest rates. If you can buy a duplex for 280k with a 1600 a month payment and rent it out for a total of 1500 a month... why wouldnt you? Even if your house devalues a lot, and your rent goes down by 300 a month, its still a very management monthly payment. After a couple years, you could demonstrate the rent as additional income and your income to debt ratio would recover so it wouldn't even tie up your "money" or ability to borrow additional money.

WINNERS AND LOSERS

The people who are going to get killed are the people who bought on a 5 year fixed and end up needing to refinance at a much higher interest rate resulting in a monthly payment that increased 50% and likely more than their total monthly income.

The other people who are going to lose are those that come under financial stress and have to quit making their house payment in order to make ends meet (like losing your job and getting a less paying one, having a baby, having to suddenly start paying child support, ect).

Both these types of people are going to be horribly upside down in their loan (owing 250k on a 200k house) and going to end up forclosed on. Doesn't sound too bad minus the bad credit and losing any assets they owned, but they will have effectively overpaid rent by probably double for the period in which they owned their house.


The people who are going to do ok are the ones who buy within their means on a fixed rate mortgage that stay in their home 20+ years. Prices will recover within 20 years even if the bubble bursts hard and you'll just not have made any money/equity and have tied up all your money unable to pursue new opportunities.

The people who win big are the ones who buy and get out right before the bubble pops or those who wait until the bubble pops and pick up property cheap.

I bought 5 years ago, and I'm waiting for the bubble to pop before I buy again. I expect it may take quite some time if the Fed stops raising interest rates due to Katrina (fed F*ing up my house buying plans). I may pick up an investment property, even at these ridiculous prices, if I can get renters to pay the mortgage on my second house. Even if house prices go down a lot, you can probably find people to pay the same rent that is currently common for your area. The only way rent will go down drastically is if house prices and interest rate go down simultaneously (if prices go down but rates go up, the same monthly payment is required to buy a house which is what renters typically avoid otherwise they would buy).
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Postby kiryan » Fri Sep 16, 2005 4:30 am

Kwirl the best thing you could do with your money is hire a financial expert to tell you what to do with it and do it fast before you F* it up.

Whether this is investing in stocks/funds or buying a house, get some real expert advice... if you go with stocks/funds don't go to the investment guy from your piddly podunk bank, but someone from a real high powered investment company. the amount of money you have, you can get someone who actually knows how to use money to make money working for you instead of the amateurs who are managing small million dollar portfolios for people who only have 1-5k to invest. Don't get sold by a glib tongued salesman, get someone with credentials.

If you want to buy a house, do some serious research then buy a house with your existing income and save the 36k for when you don't have a job. If you had a solid work history you could consider sinking 20k of it into the house, but houses don't stop at the house payment. You will have repairs and maintenance needs over time.

---

I'd be surprised if you weren't far from the the incredibly stupid person you were 2 years ago. You might've learned a thing or two and gone "hey I was really dumb, theres no possible way I could still be that dumb" until the next time you have a eye opening revelation... I'm sure you have a lot left to learn judging by your first post talking about taking a 36k, veritable gold mine from the standpoint of your previous means, and investing it in a car that will be worth 5,000 dollars in 5 years.

Heres some predictions:

You've already spent 150 dollars taking people out to dinner, like family or friends, in celebration and/or picked up the tab at least 4x when you didn't need to.

Your either seriously contemplating or have already bought some toys for a total of 500 - 1.5k. Most likely this is either a new computer/upgades, a stereo or planning on the xbox 360/ps3.

If you don't put together a solid financial plan on what you are going to do with your 36k, you'll have blown the money within 18 months.

Heres some more advice:

Find a job, even if its a very low paying job,and live off the earnings from your job (assuming your not working which I'd say is 70/30).

double and triple think any christmas purchases this holiday season. Just because you have the money, doesn't mean your GF needs a $1,000 pair of earrings or your family needs a $2500 plasma TV because you never bought anyone gifts before... DO NOT CHANGE YOUR SPENDING HABITS JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVE A LITTLE MONEY IN THE BANK.
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Postby Vigis » Fri Sep 16, 2005 5:07 am

Kiryan is right here.

The year before I graduated from college, I got into a car accident that caused some pretty decent damage. I was a passenger and oh-so-lucky for me, there were some circumstances that made it look like the insurance company was going to be able to win in a court of law.

The insurance company refused to pay my medical bills so I hired a lawyer. I would not have gone after a dime if they had. Long story short, I got a lawyer, got my medical bills paid, ended up with a third of the settlement I would have gotten if those circumstances hadn't happened, and blew too much of it.

You got a windfall Daz, that is all that it is. If you can work, get to work and live off that while the windfall can make money for you. Do NOT buy a new car or (as in my case) sink money into a classic car that ends up costing you more than if you had bought a new one. If you can't work, your attorney pretty much screwed you in order to get the quick money from a settlement.

Since you got 36k, I would suggest blowing at MOST, 1/4 of it. 9k is a pretty decent amount of extra cash. Put the rest of it to work for you. You are still fairly young, wait until you have the cash to put down 20-30 percent on a new place, then go with a 15 year mortgage. You will end up with a house, but you won't end up with a 30 year payment.

Treat it like it was money entrusted to you, use it when absolutely necessary, but make it grow for you. Don't trust just any joe blow off the streat to handle it for you. This is money you already have, so make sure you take the time to find somebody who runs less of a risk of losing it for you.

If you are looking for an investment that will be solid, don't sink it into a house (Katrina should have shown what happens to houses) Sink it into land. Land never loses its value even if the house on top of it is nothing but a pile of junk. Land might or might not increase in value like a hot stock or houses have been, but the land will give you a steady increase over time, and you will never lose it.

Just my opinion. You could always do the same thing I did, throw a huge party or two, sink some money into a car, buy whatever you thought you needed, and make sure your friends drink for free for a night or two.

The smart choice is to invest at least 75% of it and don't touch it unless it is absolutely needed.
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Postby Verarb » Fri Sep 16, 2005 6:53 pm

Sorry gonna hijack a bit.
Any of you live in NYC?
$500,000 for a 2 BR and all that insanity? you all think real estate gonna bust here as well?.

From what i hear from experts NYC is prolly one of the few places where property is Not overvalued.

thinking i should pack up and move to kansas.
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Postby Ashiwi » Fri Sep 16, 2005 6:59 pm

Come to Skiatook, V! 36K would have bought him the property, the house, a decent car, and left him plenty left over to play with. All that and I get to watch bunnies playing in my yard when I wake up in the mornings.
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Postby kwirl » Fri Sep 16, 2005 7:17 pm

actually kiryan, i've had the same job for a year now - i do php programming, sql database migration, and search engine optimization/consulting.

i will buy a new computer, thats for personal use, no real argument there.
i will be buying a car, but since i don't own a car at the moment, its something i need now that i can't walk. if i get a new car, it will be one with a solid resell value, if i get a used car it will be one that will last a long time.
i said my friend bought a home on those conditions, not that i would. i am considering putting 25 thousand down on a low-interest mortgage on a townhome somewhere. i'm going to rent out the other two bedrooms to help make the mortgage payments, and see if it meets the real estate market's expectations.
oh, and i don't celebrate holidays - so i never spend any money on gifts. :P
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Postby Corth » Fri Sep 16, 2005 7:34 pm

Verarb,

NYC and Long Island are among the most overvalued, imho, behind only California. Long Island in particular is going to die a gruesome death. Between 20% per year price increases over the past 5-6 years, and RE taxes that are among the highest in the nation, its a recipe for disaster. The outlook isn't much better for NYC. If we assume that the collapse of the real estate bubble will correspond with a prolonged recession, which is exactly what happened when Japan's RE bubble popped, then NYC is the last place you want to be. NYC gets hit much harder than the rest of the country from a bad economy. If times get bad, so will crime, and people will not want to live there.

Corth
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Postby rylan » Fri Sep 16, 2005 7:58 pm

The thing is though, you can't build any more housing in NYC... theres no land. Same goes for a lot of the major cities with high property values. The only way I can see that it will drop is if a lot of the people decide to move away to someplace cheaper farther south when they retire.
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Postby Mitharx » Sat Sep 17, 2005 2:01 am

Nothing in this thread is about saving money on your car insurance...
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Postby kiryan » Mon Sep 19, 2005 2:05 am

Your gonna do whatever you want kwirl and its fine its your life, but you came here asking for advice.

You've been getting by fine without a car, but now that you have cash you "need" a car? Maybe you do, maybe you don't. I took the bus 40 minutes each way in Los Angeles for 6 months sitting next to smelly unshowered vagrants in my suit, because I wasn't sure the job would last long enough to justify the extra expense and hassle... and I had a car that was collecting dust at my parent's house in Oregon. I washed my dry clean only shirts in the sink with some dry clean in the sink soap that was $10 for 100 washes instead of $1.50 each shirt.

There are things you need and then there are things you think you need.

question every purchase
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Postby Dalar » Mon Sep 19, 2005 4:29 pm

Dude, isn't that dry clean shit toxic? Oh yea, advise me next! I want to buy a 2006 Civic Coupe.
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Postby rylan » Mon Sep 19, 2005 5:30 pm

Dalar wrote:Dude, isn't that dry clean shit toxic? Oh yea, advise me next! I want to buy a 2006 Civic Coupe.


Are you going to pimp it out?
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Postby Verarb » Mon Sep 19, 2005 5:31 pm

Heya ash hope you're enjoying it over there.

Hahah so Corth it sounds like a Lose Lose situation in NYC.

Cant afford it now or get my ass shot when i Can afford.

You still live around here?
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Postby Corth » Mon Sep 19, 2005 6:29 pm

Yeah, Verarb. I'm happily renting in Long Island. :)
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Postby Dalar » Mon Sep 19, 2005 8:09 pm

rylan wrote:
Dalar wrote:Dude, isn't that dry clean shit toxic? Oh yea, advise me next! I want to buy a 2006 Civic Coupe.


Are you going to pimp it out?


No, just
http://automobiles.honda.com/models/spe ... ategory=LX
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Postby Corth » Mon Sep 19, 2005 8:16 pm

I thought there was a rule that Asians have to pimp out their Hondas! :)

Corth
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Postby Dalar » Mon Sep 19, 2005 8:21 pm

Those asians are either hella rich or hella poor and don't know better. I'm somewhere in the middle.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

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Postby Tanras » Tue Sep 20, 2005 12:33 am

Corth wrote:Buying property no money down in the midst of a housing bubble... in California of all places. Good luck to you my friend. Just remember the foreclosure attorney is just doing his job.


Seriously. . .do not fall for the same trap everyone else has. There is a reason this seems too good to be true.
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Postby teflor the ranger » Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:04 am

Tanras wrote:
Corth wrote:Buying property no money down in the midst of a housing bubble... in California of all places. Good luck to you my friend. Just remember the foreclosure attorney is just doing his job.


Seriously. . .do not fall for the same trap everyone else has. There is a reason this seems too good to be true.


Mortgage insurance. If you're being an idiot, at least cover your #@!.

Btw, there is no housing bubble. Just fewer manufacturing jobs. Also, in 2014 California is going to slide into the ocean.
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Postby Corth » Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:53 am

Mortgage insurance, eh? :)
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



Goddamned slippery mage.
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Postby avak » Tue Sep 20, 2005 6:25 pm

lol, now all I need is someone to sell me some bankruptcy insurance right before the holidays.

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