Some pallie lovin?

Submit and discuss your ideas for the MUD.
Karae
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Some pallie lovin?

Postby Karae » Tue Dec 02, 2003 2:48 am

Alright I was thinking our 10th circle only contains one spell Holy Word. Now if you have a holy avenger like most paladins do at the time they get this spell, its almost useless.

So maybe another spell 10th circle would be kinda cool.

Maybe a spell called Holy Sacrafice.
Works like death pact, it lets the paladin take hits into the negative hitpoints. Say he can tank and deal damage till about -50, and say after that he gets incapped, and last till about -100 after that he dies. Has a short duration. If it wears off while in negative hitpoints insta death. As a side affect, if the mob you where tanking was good aligned, It would work in reverse dealing damage to yourself, and maybe with neutral too.

It kinda makes since since Paladin's gods are supposed to give them the strength to fight almost any evil, even if they have to make the ultimate sacrifice. Dunno just an idea what do you all think?
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Postby Aldavien » Tue Dec 02, 2003 4:39 am

Personally I would much rather have something like the anti-paladin spell Unholy aura. Doesn't make much sense to me that they have a sorta anti-goodie shield spell while their goodie counterparts lack an anti-evil shield spell. Might make paladins a little more desirable for groups but due to the recent changes for the mounts/mount code (Anti)Paladins are imo able to hold their own at tanking just as much as warriors.
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Postby Cirath » Tue Dec 02, 2003 2:00 pm

The problem with a paladin version of unholy aura is two fold. First, and less importantly, paladins are geared more towards defense/healing, while APs are geared more towards offense. Second, about 80% of the zone/exp mobs in the mud are evil aligned. which would make this a obscenely powerful spell. I'm not saying that paladins don't need another spell at tenth circle, I just think a fireshield vs evil is to much. Besides, holy avenger is godawfully powerful and easy to get now.

Oh, and please, for the love of god, remove harm from the AP spell list. It is worthless.
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Postby Aldavien » Tue Dec 02, 2003 5:43 pm

Wouldn't be too over powered I dont' think...for the mobs to take any significant damage from hitting the shield, the paladin would have to be getting hitpretty hard. Yes, most of the mobs on the mud are evil but should that really be a factor in how powerful a spells is? There are places where unholy aura is useable in zone...is it obscenely powerful? How much of a difference does it make in Seelie or parts of Clouds? Debatable whether the spell is offensive in nature or not...the help file on unholy aura calls it a protective type spell.

Yes, the holy avenger is fairly easy to get, I agree quest should be made a little harder to justify how powerful it has become...You do however get a handful of items along with the unholy. Unholy also has farsee/sense-life/infravision which in addition to the other procs it has makes it a weapon at least as good as the holy imo. I wouldn't say the imbalance in the difficulty of obtaining these weapons is as out of balance as people claim...
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Postby mynazzaraxxsyn » Tue Dec 02, 2003 6:03 pm

So how about instead of it damaging the mob it heals the paladin? On the flip side if a good mob hits it it damages the paladin.
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Postby Hyldryn » Tue Dec 02, 2003 6:21 pm

Gah thats even more powerful.
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Postby Karae » Tue Dec 02, 2003 6:47 pm

What about a more powerful protection from evil spell.

Lowers your ac, and has added effects for deffense when tanking evil aligned mobs, but then when tanking good aligned mobs it it raises your ac and makes you easier to hit and what not
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Postby Hyldryn » Tue Dec 02, 2003 6:55 pm

The problem with trying to balance a protection spell by making work counterproductively on good aligned mobs is twofold. First, there aren't nearly as many good aligned mobs in zones. If you look at major zones you have, what, seelie and clouds? Second, you don't have to cast it on yourself in those situations.
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Postby Karae » Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:01 pm

Well I just think that pallies need a 10th circle spell thats defensive in nature.
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Paladins are fine as they are

Postby Aedaris » Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:08 pm

pretty powerful, I think. I also like casting my holy words in zones.
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Postby Hyldryn » Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:19 pm

I wonder if anyone will take my idea seriously... but here it goes.

SACRIFICE "SACRIFICE"
Innate Ability.

Syntax: sacrifice
Area of effect: <room>
Duration: Instantaneous, 1/week
Aggressive: No
Class/Level: Paladin 50th
Type of Ability: Innate

When the battle fairs poorly for the party, the paladin may make a heroic attempt to turn the tides towards victory at the cost of his/her own life. By calling on the holy powers of his/her god the paladin surrenders his/her life force which imbues his allies with newfound strength.

Basically, by sacrificing the paladin dies and loses xp for the death plus an extra 4% for balance. All party members in the room gets healed for the paladin's current hp at the time of sacrifice. No hp will be granted over maximum. The paladin's corpse may be ressed.
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Postby Karae » Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:30 pm

It sounds cool, and could possbily prevent alot of cr's.
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Postby thanuk » Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:33 pm

Paladins cast spells? In zones?

Weird.
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Postby mynazzaraxxsyn » Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:39 pm

thanuk wrote:Paladins cast spells? In zones?

Weird.


Yeah its called armor.

And as to the sacrifice idea while its an interesting idea you have written up an innate, the thread is about 10th circle spells.
Lilithelle stops using a softly throbbing piece of flesh.
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Postby Ashiwi » Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:45 pm

How about a spell that switches the paladin and one other PC at time of death? It could be cast on the paladin pre-fight, and if a member of the group dies, the paladin takes the sacrifice instead, bringing the other groupmember back to half hps or so and killing the paladin.

Is it just me, or are all sorts of people willing to chime in when it comes to new and unusual ways to kill paladins?
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Postby Karae » Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:47 pm

We don't mind dying as long as we save someone in the process, so new ways to do it are fine with me.
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Postby thanuk » Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:48 pm

Ashiwi wrote:How about a spell that switches the paladin and one other PC at time of death? It could be cast on the paladin pre-fight, and if a member of the group dies, the paladin takes the sacrifice instead, bringing the other groupmember back to half hps or so and killing the paladin.


They have a skill like that already. It's called "layhands thanuk"
Mysrel tells you 'have my babies'

You tell Mysrel 'u want me to be ur baby daddy?'

Mysrel tells you 'daddy? No, I think you have the terminology wrong'

You tell Mysrel 'comeon now we both know i would be the top'

Mysrel tells you 'can be where ever you want to be, yer still getting ****** like a drunken cheerleader'
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Postby Waelos » Tue Dec 02, 2003 11:33 pm

Well. . .I think if it was something akin to Deathpact. . . where you cast 'newpallispell' target and if the target dies during the duration of the spell, the paladin dies instead (no matter his/her current state) and the target is restored to full hps. Don't think that would be too strong. . . as you'd need it to be full hps to make it worth a damn in a zone. That invoker who got crushed 1 round ago is probably going to get re-crushed fairly quickly even with this spell unles thye have their full hps (giving other chars enough time to resc/stone/etc)

Cool idea otherwise =)

Lost
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Postby rylan » Wed Dec 03, 2003 12:03 am

I still think a 'guard' skill for paladins, where they can pick one person to guard, where they either autorescue if that person gets switched to, or block the attacks targeted at that person.
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Postby Tasan » Wed Dec 03, 2003 12:34 am

Oh yes, I can just see it now.

4 paladins each guarding an invoker... boy will that be balanced!

Seriously, not every paladin at 50 has an avenger... or shouldn't(what happened to difficult quests). I'm sure for them, being able to cast the spell is a benefit.

T
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Postby Aldavien » Wed Dec 03, 2003 2:00 am

Ashiwi wrote: Is it just me, or are all sorts of people willing to chime in when it comes to new and unusual ways to kill paladins?


No, it most definitly is not just you :P
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Postby Aldavien » Wed Dec 03, 2003 2:00 am

Ashiwi wrote:Is it just me, or are all sorts of people willing to chime in when it comes to new and unusual ways to kill paladins?


No, it most definitly is not just you :P
Aldavien
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Postby Aldavien » Wed Dec 03, 2003 2:01 am

Ashiwi wrote:How about a spell that switches the paladin and one other PC at time of death? It could be cast on the paladin pre-fight, and if a member of the group dies, the paladin takes the sacrifice instead, bringing the other groupmember back to half hps or so and killing the paladin.

Is it just me, or are all sorts of people willing to chime in when it comes to new and unusual ways to kill paladins?


No, it is definitily not just you...come on people, its not like paladins have access to your cheesy DS exp :P
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Postby rylan » Wed Dec 03, 2003 3:07 am

Tasan wrote:Oh yes, I can just see it now.
4 paladins each guarding an invoker... boy will that be balanced!
T


Oh come on, you actually think a group would take 4 paladins? We rarely have one, and they have lots less hps than dwarf/barb etc warriors. If you want to be absurd I can come up with plenty other examples where things can be unbalanced with the current rules.
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Postby Gromikazer » Wed Dec 03, 2003 7:52 am

Paladins don't need cheesy DS exp. They get that exp from EVERY evil mob they kill with thier 25% bonus.

If you actually think paladins need "more" I think some people are smoking a little to much crack.
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Postby Cirath » Wed Dec 03, 2003 9:17 am

Gromikazer wrote:If you actually think paladins need "more" I think some people are smoking a little to much crack.


agree.
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Postby Cordan » Wed Dec 03, 2003 7:30 pm

Cirath wrote:
Gromikazer wrote:If you actually think paladins need "more" I think some people are smoking a little to much crack.


agree.


1 fully loaded level 50 warrior.
1 fully loaded level 50 paladin.

(putting aside all relational things, you don't know either of them.)

Your group has one slot open and you need a tank. Is there anything about a paladin that even makes you consider asking them first?

Serious question mind you, I'd honestly like to know what's going on.
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Postby Cordan » Wed Dec 03, 2003 7:44 pm

And let me explain myself before someone comes to the wrong conclusion.

I'm not saying paladins should be chosen over warriors all the time. But it would be nice if there were different aspects of group/zone dynamics that would make a group consider asking a paladin to tank before asking a warrior to tank. Not replacing the warrior mind you, just make it more flavorful to have a palidork along.
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Postby thanuk » Wed Dec 03, 2003 7:47 pm

Cordan wrote:
1 fully loaded level 50 warrior.
1 fully loaded level 50 paladin.

(putting aside all relational things, you don't know either of them.)

Your group has one slot open and you need a tank. Is there anything about a paladin that even makes you consider asking them first?



The real question is what zone are you doing?

If you need someone to bash, you take the warrior. If you're doing SF and the warrior is evil, you take the warrior. If you're doing any zone full evil evil aligned mobs and you don't need a basher, you take the paladin. They really aren't that bad, but its not our fault all you fools refuse to wear hps eq to make up for your human inadequacies.

I'd rather have Selzan than 90% of the warriors on the mud given the choice.
Mysrel tells you 'have my babies'

You tell Mysrel 'u want me to be ur baby daddy?'

Mysrel tells you 'daddy? No, I think you have the terminology wrong'

You tell Mysrel 'comeon now we both know i would be the top'

Mysrel tells you 'can be where ever you want to be, yer still getting ****** like a drunken cheerleader'
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Postby Dalar » Thu Dec 04, 2003 12:32 am

The main problem with paladins is that they are human. If there was a grey elf paladin I'd take him.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.
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Postby Stamm » Thu Dec 04, 2003 5:08 am

Dorf paladin!
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Postby Ashiwi » Thu Dec 04, 2003 2:35 pm

Dalar wrote:The main problem with paladins is that they are human. If there was a grey elf paladin I'd take him.


If there were grey elf paladins I would have played one. They wouldn't be real paladins, though, but imagine the RP potential! Mmmmmm... bladedancers....
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Postby thanuk » Thu Dec 04, 2003 3:14 pm

Ashiwi wrote:
Dalar wrote:The main problem with paladins is that they are human. If there was a grey elf paladin I'd take him.


If there were grey elf paladins I would have played one. They wouldn't be real paladins, though, but imagine the RP potential! Mmmmmm... bladedancers....


Yeah cuz imagining the RP potential is real high on dartan's list:)
Mysrel tells you 'have my babies'

You tell Mysrel 'u want me to be ur baby daddy?'

Mysrel tells you 'daddy? No, I think you have the terminology wrong'

You tell Mysrel 'comeon now we both know i would be the top'

Mysrel tells you 'can be where ever you want to be, yer still getting ****** like a drunken cheerleader'
Stamm
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Postby Stamm » Thu Dec 04, 2003 3:43 pm

I've thought and discussed dwarven and elven paladins in the past, and I don't see an issue with either of them.

Dwarves are a pretty religious race, and elves can be too.

The problem I guess would be that dwarves would be significantly better as a paladin than humans. Can you see any powerplayer picking human over dwarf?
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Postby Vahok » Thu Dec 04, 2003 5:23 pm

Sir Stamm riding into battle on his trusty steed Stumps the donkey...
Meatshield
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Postby Stamm » Thu Dec 04, 2003 5:38 pm

Paladins are holy warriors. The riding the horse part doesn't necessarily have to come in to it.

He's called Dobbin the mule anyway. :P
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Postby thanuk » Thu Dec 04, 2003 5:42 pm

Stamm wrote:
He's called Dobbin the mule anyway. :P


That's what I call....
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YOUR MOTHER!
(didn't see that coming did you?)
Mysrel tells you 'have my babies'

You tell Mysrel 'u want me to be ur baby daddy?'

Mysrel tells you 'daddy? No, I think you have the terminology wrong'

You tell Mysrel 'comeon now we both know i would be the top'

Mysrel tells you 'can be where ever you want to be, yer still getting ****** like a drunken cheerleader'

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