Mentalist - 10th sphere Area Quest Spell

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alvathair
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Mentalist - 10th sphere Area Quest Spell

Postby alvathair » Sat Apr 09, 2005 12:56 pm

bit of a weakness here IMO. given that the majority of other caster classes have some form of dragable area nastie at this sphere, not to mention many of them seem to have better if not more elemental type spells i propose the following:

Maelstrom / Elemental Storm
lvl 46 (10th circle)
Quest

3 round dragable, area damage.
4 possible elemental outcomes for each round its in effect. namely:
1. fire storm - damage plus chance to burn (like lava)
2. ice - damage + chance for area ice layer
3. earth - damage + potential quake
4. wind - damage plus potential area disarm (ie. whirlwind)


i like the idea personally, but curious to hear what others think.


tai / ganj / loshe
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Postby Pril » Sat Apr 09, 2005 2:17 pm

Personally I don't like it you can call it voker envy since vokers still don't have a draggable spell *drool* :p

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Postby Ambar » Sat Apr 09, 2005 2:45 pm

I like :)

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Postby Ashiwi » Sat Apr 09, 2005 3:08 pm

As nice as it is, my personal opinion is that Elementalists are the last class that needs any more spells. They're a one-man army of destruction already, what do they need a draggable spell for?
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Postby Lahgen » Sat Apr 09, 2005 3:45 pm

The only way I would want them to have this is if they got rid of Lava Burst and replaced it with this.
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Postby kiryan » Mon Apr 11, 2005 3:27 am

hi let's make every class the same.

and to top it off lets add spells to a class that has needs a downgrade to their healing and endless elemental trick.
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Postby Nurpy Fuzzyfeet » Mon Apr 11, 2005 3:57 am

Ashiwi wrote:As nice as it is, my personal opinion is that Elementalists are the last class that needs any more spells. They're a one-man army of destruction already, what do they need a draggable spell for?


Agree.
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Postby Sarell » Mon Apr 11, 2005 4:39 am

I Illusionist, lich druids have dragable spells, !chanter, voker, ele? I'm with the eles have enough spells already and I like classes being different stand. I'd be all up for making doom drag as well as rot tho, or add some neat effects to it to make it awesome like tendrils. :9
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Postby shalath » Mon Apr 11, 2005 9:15 am

Sarell wrote:I'd be all up for making doom drag as well as rot tho, or add some neat effects to it to make it awesome like tendrils. :9


Can we also make doom only hit one target each time like tendrils? :-)

Damn, why do people talk about tendrils as an area spell? It aggros everything, but it only damages one mob at a time... :-(

Ok, so it still rocks, but bah :-)

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Postby Maedor » Mon Apr 11, 2005 6:47 pm

Sweet idea Tai, but a new twinky spell for eles is 100% not necessary. If they got a spell like this, they'd need more than just losing lava burst...

Fire embody also happens to be one of the best spells in the game in many aspects...and I don't see any way to justify giving another spell with great twink potential to a class that already is !bash, stones, pwbs, makes pets, heals etc etc

The concept of the spell is very cool though-just too overpowered for a class that is on the verge of being overpowered already
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Postby Delmair Aamoren » Wed Apr 13, 2005 8:36 pm

Ashiwi wrote:As nice as it is, my personal opinion is that Elementalists are the last class that needs any more spells. They're a one-man army of destruction already, what do they need a draggable spell for?


First off, i agree that they don't need a draggable spell. But realistically, i don't think elementalists are a "one-man army". Yes they can do fairly well on their own. the pseudo-healing of the embodiment spells is definately powerful, in addition to their other array, but have you ever tried killing undead or elementals with an elementalist? its really quite tough. your best damage by FAR is earthblood. Earthblood only works on things with blood. If you encounter an elemental, or undead, anything wraithform, etc. you're prettymuch hosed. It takes considerably longer to kill these critters. Ironically, if i were an elementalist, i would expect that i could kick some elemental ass. This is far from how it actually works =(. Do they need a draggable spell? no. Do they need some tweaking still? hell yes.

The best solution i have to offer is just make the sorcerer class again, and limit which spells you can quest. if you quest dscales, you can't quest X other spells. if you quest inferno you can't quest X other spells... etc. So around 20th level you choose your path, and based on your choices there, it lays out the rest of your class options. Yes, this would allow some smart invokers to get stoneskin. but without spec enchantment you wouldn't have a very effective stoneskin. The combinations are limitless. Sounds like more fun to me than the current system.
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Postby Maedor » Wed Apr 13, 2005 10:03 pm

Elementalists do fine against undead/wraiths/elementals.

help whirlwind
help earth stone
help lava burst

Earthblood casts faster than the above spells, but the damage isnt that much better.

Eles are still a one man army. If you dont believe me, ask the manscorpions, or the archivist, or the spider queen, or artimus, or the old dragons or....
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Postby kiryan » Wed Apr 13, 2005 10:21 pm

agree with maedor and ashiwi
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Postby Sarell » Thu Apr 14, 2005 6:04 am

shalath wrote:
Sarell wrote:I'd be all up for making doom drag as well as rot tho, or add some neat effects to it to make it awesome like tendrils. :9


Can we also make doom only hit one target each time like tendrils? :-)

Damn, why do people talk about tendrils as an area spell? It aggros everything, but it only damages one mob at a time... :-(

Ok, so it still rocks, but bah :-)

-akeb


Stop being silly! You wouldn't trade tendrils for doom in a bazillion years because anywhere you are using doom for your damage you're targetting one mob anyhow :P Anyhow, back on topic sorta, while im not into this idea, those spell ideas for chanter Locky posted in new thread are freakin' awesome.
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Postby fotex » Thu Apr 14, 2005 7:01 am

I think illusionists would love a better area damage spell (that gets past globe)! 7th circle area phantasmal blades often has to share slots with shadow flux, and takes 5* to cast.

Also, if you're using doom to target a single mob... well, you probably shouldn't be. Not every spell should be perfect for every situation. (except quake and holy word)

And to the thread topic, I think elemental storm would be great, as long as you it's compensated with a very long cast time, at least 7* or so.
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Postby Marrus » Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:08 am

Cool spell but compeletely ridiculous. Sorry! The last class in the game that needs any more power added to it is elementalist. And sniffling over a weakness against certain mob types! Haha. Perish the thought of the mud's most soloable class having any sort of weakness! :P

Fotex is right that phantasmal blades is pretty useless (it is!). Crappy damage and a huge cast time make it not worth casting, imo. That's ok though because phantasmal tendrils is a wonderful spell. Why would you want to cast something lesser?

However, I do have some minor illus spell gripes. I know spells like tranquility were horribly abused, but is not there some way of fixing them? Must it be all or nothing? If it's nothing then delete the stupid spell and replace it with some other toy.
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Postby Delmair Aamoren » Thu Apr 14, 2005 5:44 pm

Maedor wrote:Elementalists do fine against undead/wraiths/elementals.

help whirlwind
help earth stone
help lava burst

Earthblood casts faster than the above spells, but the damage isnt that much better.

Eles are still a one man army. If you dont believe me, ask the manscorpions, or the archivist, or the spider queen, or artimus, or the old dragons or....


I have done a significant amount of testing in this matter, and earthblood does significantly more damage than whirlwind. Haven't played a lot with earthstone, so i am going to refrain from commenting there, and lava burst is a tickle at best. Yes, area damage needs to be less to a target than a single target spell, this i understand. My point is further hammered home by your examples listed. of those which are wraithform or undead? none? ok then. Are they still a 1 man army? sure. as long as the target isn't wraithform or undead. Then it takes a lot longer =P

Not saying they need the upgrade listed above, just saying they do have their weaknesses
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Postby kiryan » Fri Apr 15, 2005 8:32 pm

>Are they still a 1 man army? sure. as long as the target isn't wraithform or undead. Then it takes a lot longer =P

1 man army = can do it alone, not can do it alone at earthblood speed.

I'm all in favor of leaving ele weak against incorporeal (however not sure why we should maintain status quo since in our infinite vision we saw it necessary to eliminate one of liches only weaknesses, undead).

I'm definitely against ele getting any kind of draggable spell. Draggable spells are cool for one main reason and used to twink for the same, you can stack casts to increase your damage output per round and you can cast an offensive spell without being subject to a mobs attacks (cast 1 room away and drag).

Pretty much against them gaining any kind of additional area damage.
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Postby Delmair Aamoren » Sat Apr 16, 2005 1:27 am

kiryan wrote:1 man army = can do it alone, not can do it alone at earthblood speed.


So this means clerics are 1 man armies? sure it takes a LONG time, but
with runs of fharm/un/holy word/etc a cleric could solo quite a few things. Yes it would take AGES, but it could be done.

I never said they need a draggable spell, i just said they definately have their weaknesses and aren't as all powerful as everyone makes them seem.
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Postby Vigis » Sat Apr 16, 2005 6:19 am

In other words, they are balanced?
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Postby teflor the ranger » Sat Apr 16, 2005 7:41 am

Maedor wrote:Elementalists do fine against undead/wraiths/elementals.

help whirlwind
help earth stone
help lava burst

Earthblood casts faster than the above spells, but the damage isnt that much better.


Earthblood damage is a much better.

Of course, some will try to argue this because some don't know any better.

Take DS Giants.

14 Earthbloods to 26+ Earth Stones

Cast + Mem total times are the same between earthblood and earth stones.

However, what you were saying before is indeed true.

Elementalists are still one-man armies - and the damage done by whirlwind, earth stones, and lava bursts are more than sufficient to get-r-done. (even though lava burst is not a targeted spell.
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Postby kiryan » Tue Apr 19, 2005 12:05 am

clerics are in no way shape or form comparable to an ele in solo ability in a legitimate comparison.
Last edited by kiryan on Tue Apr 19, 2005 2:12 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Grintor » Tue Apr 19, 2005 12:19 am

did you prac specialiaze: teleportation on this character too?


heh the mud had a lot of mean people back in the day when you asked for advice.
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Postby Gormal » Tue Apr 19, 2005 10:02 pm

Elementalists are more like a three-to-one marny I think. Based purely on this fact, they need an immediate downgrade to a three man one-y.
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Postby Birile » Wed May 04, 2005 5:01 pm

I hate watching repeats. But if I change the channel I might see an upgrade/downgrade invokers debate and then I'd REALLY shoot myself.
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Postby moritheil » Mon Jun 06, 2005 9:55 pm

Gormal wrote:Elementalists are more like a three-to-one marny I think. Based purely on this fact, they need an immediate downgrade to a three man one-y.


This assertion simply cannot be argued with.

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