need before greed.

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flib
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need before greed.

Postby flib » Fri Nov 14, 2008 9:02 am

it's a sorting device used by another game, won't name it. But it works well and it's nowhere near as random or sometimes frustrating as the bidding system we have now. So maybe not a copy and paste version of it, but something similar would be pretty useful I think.

mainly because I for one, get kinda frustrated when someone wins something that can improve my set when theyre bidding on it solely for trade or an alt or something similar. Not saying there isn't any room for bidding on something that isn't for your class, that's the point of the greed option.
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Re: need before greed.

Postby Kissa » Fri Nov 14, 2008 7:45 pm

these days its too hard to tell who's main is who's..
too many people have mounds of level 50's ..
who knows, maybe they are zoning with their alt character, and bidding on gear that improves their main character..

i dont see a problem with trading gear you win from bids though.. they devote the same amount of time to do the zone as you, but dont neccesarily need it that badly. So they perhaps trade it for something they need. It would be unfair to deny
them a bid just cause they don't "need" the item for their character at the moment.
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Re: need before greed.

Postby flib » Fri Nov 14, 2008 9:04 pm

sorry, I disagree. It floods the game with random for trade only eq that people have back logged in their storage cache's. Certain items are for certain classes also on more than one occasion I've been outbid by someone who already had the item. that's bunk in my book.
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Re: need before greed.

Postby Thilindel » Fri Nov 14, 2008 10:16 pm

Personally, I always liked Touk's system. He looks at who's bidding what, then hands out on his decision.
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Re: need before greed.

Postby Kissa » Sat Nov 15, 2008 12:03 am

i think that can lead to too much drama
accusations of favoritisms etc etc

maybe it'll work out though since the pbase is so small.....
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Re: need before greed.

Postby mynazzaraxxsyn » Sat Nov 15, 2008 2:00 am

Kissa wrote:these days its too hard to tell who's main is who's..

Not so much who the main is, but which character was taken to the zone. If you bring your enchanter, don't bid on the hitter gear. If you're the tank don't bid on the cleric weapon.

Then there is the grey area of I want to bring my tank but we need an enchanter or a cleric and you play a different class.
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Adriorn Darkcloak
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Re: need before greed.

Postby Adriorn Darkcloak » Sat Nov 15, 2008 7:20 am

Have zoning points. You get xxx points every zone you do in 15-man group.
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Re: need before greed.

Postby Kissa » Sat Nov 15, 2008 5:44 pm

Not so much who the main is, but which character was taken to the zone. If you bring your enchanter, don't bid on the hitter gear. If you're the tank don't bid on the cleric weapon.


Some zones offer very little gear or zero gear for a certain class. Sometimes its just very low tier gear also. If this is the case, it would kind of discourage people from playing the class... and sometimes it can be a neccesary class ie.. enchanter/cleric etc.
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Re: need before greed.

Postby flib » Sat Nov 15, 2008 7:27 pm

here's the point, people bid on things not because they need them. But because they wanna stockpile and trade. I honestly don't care if you bid on something that is for your main if I see you the next day and youre using it on them. If not, if you're just bidding on something you already have or something you don't need then that's bs, and there should be ways to stop it.
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Re: need before greed.

Postby Kissa » Sat Nov 15, 2008 10:44 pm

if that were the case, there would be no incentive for many people to zone...
its hard enough to get a zone group going these days

a good handful of people who still actively play the game only need tiamat gear left to upgrade their sets. So if a rule came out saying you couldn't bid on stuff that you dont need/already have then... why zone ? yeah yeah i know there are other joys in zoning etc etc.. but im willing to bet most people go for the loot...
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Re: need before greed.

Postby Kegor » Sun Nov 16, 2008 2:24 am

Without people having tons of alts and tons of gear for those alts, most zones wouldn't happen. If your invoker is your only zoning character and you don't like people winning bids on eq you can use to improve on because you don't think they need it, I would have to say you are the one that is guilty of being greedy and impatient.

If you play long enough, and bid on the stuff you want long enough, you will eventually get it even if it takes many years. If that starts to take too long for you, do what other people do and bid on useful stuff that people want so you can use that to trade for what you want.

That's just the way it is.

Complaining about losing splits to people that don't need the item is just another one of those really foolish topics that someone is always whining about from time to time. People always need things to continue to upgrade their gear for their alts to improve the zoning process for themselves and everyone else.

You would be well advised to accept this and stop trying to make the people that facilitate your zoning feel bad about continuing to expand their ability to do so. You will get yours if you stick with it just like everyone else does, I promise.
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Re: need before greed.

Postby Raiwen » Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:30 am

so, basically, what you're saying is, if I can't bid on XYZ gear that I need for my tank because I'm playing my cleric or enchanter for a zone, then I will lose out to the other tank that's in the group.

Fine.

I just won't play my cleric or chanter anymore for certain zones.

Which, I guess means that a lot of those zones you want to go on just won't happen.

Fine.

Looks like more guild only zones in my furture...
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Re: need before greed.

Postby Yayaril » Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:37 pm

I've always been fond of the random roll on a single piece of the loot. I don't care if someone else wins that +5 spiked codpiece I wanted, as long as I had a shot at getting it. I don't feel it's the group-leader's job to determine whether or not I'm worthy of a piece of gear.
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Re: need before greed.

Postby Thilindel » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:19 pm

Can you quest said codpiece to have multiple flaps?! That'd rock!
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Re: need before greed.

Postby flib » Tue Nov 18, 2008 8:03 am

the aim of this wasn't that my pc doesn't win enough, it's just to make it more fair in zone bidding situations. The issue I guess lies with the fact that trading can happen, vs another game where once you use it it binds to you. So i guess my idea is faulty, my bad.
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Re: need before greed.

Postby Inames » Tue Dec 09, 2008 2:55 am

you might as well add zoning point obelisks at the end of zones like the epic points on duris and let people just buy their gear.. anything else would end up being at the discresion of the leader.. if a particular leader prefers to hand things out theres nothing you can do to stop them. some people like stockpiling gear for alts on multiplay events, some people even like stockpiling gear so they can hand it out to people that need so they dont go to waste. like just yesterday i won my 5th sapphire bracelet from IC2.. the first 2 i use, the next 2 i handed out, and my new one im holding onto until i need it or find someone that has real use for it. and i cant count how many times lilithelle has handed out gear to newbies.. theres quite a few people that are like that, but if you go need before greed like you suggest then no newbies would be able to zone when they hit level 50 and probably wouldnt even stick around long enough to get to 50.. i think your lucky to even have a chance at getting items from zones.

but theres no sense forcing someone to bid something for the class they are playing either, because you can hardly take a dwarf war with 600hp and +20AC to BC just so they can bid combat boots when they have a well geared lvl 50 enchanter and nobody else does..
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Re: need before greed.

Postby Gormal » Fri Dec 12, 2008 11:49 am

Need soulbound gear for this to work.

Need a functioning playerbase for soulbound gear to be viable.
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Re: need before greed.

Postby spunionring » Mon Dec 15, 2008 3:07 am

Adriorn Darkcloak wrote:Have zoning points. You get xxx points every zone you do in 15-man group.


I like this. Since the obvious problem is, that if you dont need anything and you arent going to be able to bid on anything, then your not going to do the zone...

BUT

If you get zone points for abstaining, that you can use later to boost another bid.. Maybe, it would leave only people that really need the item actually bidding, and ppl would still zone to help the person in need. Of course this idea has many potential flaws, and would be a pain in the ass for said leader.

I like alternate ideas for bid systems. Clearly there is no need to refute the subject's topic again :P

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