twilight
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- Sojourner
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twilight
whats your opinion nostalgia weapon or owns? id say nostalgia compared to thinkgs like darkened steel and gythka, perhaps even 2h gith. id like to see it return to prominence via whichever means (downgrade other weapons or ugprade twilight).
some ideas: upgrade dice/hit/dam, put double/triple procs back in like in the old days. maybe you need to tweak the proc to reduce chance for proc while already beserked (100+ damrolls was pretty crazy).
anyhow im not really for ugprading power, but i dislike seeing twilights sitting in backpacks in favor of things like gythka. sure invasion really isnt all that uber anymore, but then again searching for a couple of rather rare mobs really isnt all that special either (however it is harder).
btw i have none of these so no personal gain involved. and id rather see the others downgraded but anyways
some ideas: upgrade dice/hit/dam, put double/triple procs back in like in the old days. maybe you need to tweak the proc to reduce chance for proc while already beserked (100+ damrolls was pretty crazy).
anyhow im not really for ugprading power, but i dislike seeing twilights sitting in backpacks in favor of things like gythka. sure invasion really isnt all that uber anymore, but then again searching for a couple of rather rare mobs really isnt all that special either (however it is harder).
btw i have none of these so no personal gain involved. and id rather see the others downgraded but anyways
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- Sojourner
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- Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2002 5:01 am
I think the best change is to make the twilight proc last a round longer. Currently it cancels an attack to proc, and assuming your hasted thats a max of 8 hits if you hit all times, and aren't tanking.
Twilight has its uses... e.g. demon/dragon/MR fights... I would like to see it a tad better though...
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Gromikazer Terrorforge -Veldruk- Orbdrin D'oloth
Twilight has its uses... e.g. demon/dragon/MR fights... I would like to see it a tad better though...
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Gromikazer Terrorforge -Veldruk- Orbdrin D'oloth
I've thought about upgrading twilight, but one thing has stuck out that imho makes twilight worth so much more.
Set char bits : FARSEE SENSE-LIFE INFRA PR-FIRE
Gythka has no such bonuses. And pound for pound damage wise, their procs do about the same damage, Gythka has some other nifty things it can do, but, then again, so does Twilight.
I'll look at losing an attack on proc, I fixed that for Gythka, can prolly fix it for twilight as well, but I'm really not in favor of making it any stronger than it is.
-Garg
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Gargauth the Outcast
Set char bits : FARSEE SENSE-LIFE INFRA PR-FIRE
Gythka has no such bonuses. And pound for pound damage wise, their procs do about the same damage, Gythka has some other nifty things it can do, but, then again, so does Twilight.
I'll look at losing an attack on proc, I fixed that for Gythka, can prolly fix it for twilight as well, but I'm really not in favor of making it any stronger than it is.
-Garg
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Gargauth the Outcast
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Gargamel:
<B>I've thought about upgrading twilight, but one thing has stuck out that imho makes twilight worth so much more.
Set char bits : FARSEE SENSE-LIFE INFRA PR-FIRE
Gythka has no such bonuses. And pound for pound damage wise, their procs do about the same damage, Gythka has some other nifty things it can do, but, then again, so does Twilight.
I'll look at losing an attack on proc, I fixed that for Gythka, can prolly fix it for twilight as well, but I'm really not in favor of making it any stronger than it is.
-Garg
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
pff = common
infra = mistweave
sense life = raven patch
farsee = jade bracelet.
how about making it so the twilight proc gives an extra attack a round?
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Dartan group-says 'Malacar I'm going to dropkick you for starting that omg Ymir thing'
<B>I've thought about upgrading twilight, but one thing has stuck out that imho makes twilight worth so much more.
Set char bits : FARSEE SENSE-LIFE INFRA PR-FIRE
Gythka has no such bonuses. And pound for pound damage wise, their procs do about the same damage, Gythka has some other nifty things it can do, but, then again, so does Twilight.
I'll look at losing an attack on proc, I fixed that for Gythka, can prolly fix it for twilight as well, but I'm really not in favor of making it any stronger than it is.
-Garg
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
pff = common
infra = mistweave
sense life = raven patch
farsee = jade bracelet.
how about making it so the twilight proc gives an extra attack a round?
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Dartan group-says 'Malacar I'm going to dropkick you for starting that omg Ymir thing'
Dalar:
pff = common
infra = mistweave
sense life = raven patch
farsee = jade bracelet.
Thats fine and dandy, cept how much hit/dam do you have to lose to get all of that? The point is that you get all of that in one item, that has max hit/dam for a 2h weapon and max dice for a 2h weapon AND procs.
And Tey, twilight floats. making it nodrop doesn't really matter that much with floating magic weapons, they don't go into puddles :P
Again, I prolly won't change the power of the proc at all, I'm not going to have it proc an extra attack, it does do alot of damage and procs quite a bit. What I will do is make it so you don't lose an attack when it procs.
-G
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Gargauth the Outcast
pff = common
infra = mistweave
sense life = raven patch
farsee = jade bracelet.
Thats fine and dandy, cept how much hit/dam do you have to lose to get all of that? The point is that you get all of that in one item, that has max hit/dam for a 2h weapon and max dice for a 2h weapon AND procs.
And Tey, twilight floats. making it nodrop doesn't really matter that much with floating magic weapons, they don't go into puddles :P
Again, I prolly won't change the power of the proc at all, I'm not going to have it proc an extra attack, it does do alot of damage and procs quite a bit. What I will do is make it so you don't lose an attack when it procs.
-G
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Gargauth the Outcast
The only common warrior class that doesn't have innate infra are barbarians. Farsee on an item is just about worthless now.. you can pop a potion in those rare circumstances where it would be useful. I'm not sure what other warrior items have sense life.. that could be a big one.
Yeah I think adding an extra round would be a very good compromise.. or even removing those bonuses and upping its damage even more. Thanks for looking into it garg.
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
Yeah I think adding an extra round would be a very good compromise.. or even removing those bonuses and upping its damage even more. Thanks for looking into it garg.
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
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- Sojourner
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Yeah, we should re do all items that do are no longer valuable in this era of the game.
Like invasion is even hard or merits an extremely powerful weapon...
We are talking about a game in which tiamat was killed within less than a year of up time, and not only killed once but 4 times.
Cheers!
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Ilshad
"Your accomplishment is nothing compared to the glory that is Ilshadrial!!" Yayaril
Like invasion is even hard or merits an extremely powerful weapon...
We are talking about a game in which tiamat was killed within less than a year of up time, and not only killed once but 4 times.
Cheers!
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Ilshad
"Your accomplishment is nothing compared to the glory that is Ilshadrial!!" Yayaril
Twilight owns. Nuff said.
I have this argument constantly with others about which is better. IMHO, Twilight is better for trolls and ogres with their superstr and higher crit percentages. Battletrance berserk + twilight proc = insane damroll (80-90+).
I agree that the proc shouldn't hose that one attack, and I also agree maybe it should last a round longer...OR the proc % could be upped a tiny bit (fraction of a percent) to compensate for this.
Twilight will never have its proper name back due to the "artifacts/relics" discussion back on Toril, and all named items being taken out of the game. I do think it needs a slightly better name than just "a black longsword of destruction".
a pitch-black fire giant longsword of the twilight furies
I can come up with the ansi if you want Garg. :P The word twilight could be replaced by midnight if necessary.
Just my 2 brain cells.
Deathmagnet
I have this argument constantly with others about which is better. IMHO, Twilight is better for trolls and ogres with their superstr and higher crit percentages. Battletrance berserk + twilight proc = insane damroll (80-90+).
I agree that the proc shouldn't hose that one attack, and I also agree maybe it should last a round longer...OR the proc % could be upped a tiny bit (fraction of a percent) to compensate for this.
Twilight will never have its proper name back due to the "artifacts/relics" discussion back on Toril, and all named items being taken out of the game. I do think it needs a slightly better name than just "a black longsword of destruction".
a pitch-black fire giant longsword of the twilight furies
I can come up with the ansi if you want Garg. :P The word twilight could be replaced by midnight if necessary.
Just my 2 brain cells.
Deathmagnet
actually garg i still on occaison have nightmares of when hadjan fumbled his twilight in hp and the armor smith guy picked it up and proceeded to clean house.
fumbling just sucks ass, and a weapon that is not only impossible for average players like myself to ever see, let alone the elites who will most likely only see one, should be !fumble.
fumbling just sucks ass, and a weapon that is not only impossible for average players like myself to ever see, let alone the elites who will most likely only see one, should be !fumble.
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- Sojourner
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i didnt forget all the flags but i tend to agree with corth, easily obtainable elsewhere. drop the flags if thats what is holding you back from beefing it up. well cept the float flag (unless you wanna replace it with the nodrop/curse flag).
thanks for looking into the losing a hit that will make it better.
gromi how do you think twilight stacks up against darkened steel and its unshruggable dam proc? course i could be wrong about it, but just speculating.
illshad what is hard? thorn? more like long and annoying. clouds is hard often. standing 1e of a stack of mobs and continuously spelling up charging and shifting in the dead isnt really hard is it? some skills yes, great eq and lucky rolls yes.
targsk whats an extra 40 damroll on 7 or 8 hits vs a proc that does roughly the same damage plus proc multiple times. as far as i understand it also ignores racial str and bonuses like battletrance/heroism in its calculations. frankly its quite limited and isn't really up to snuff with today's standards.
anyhow ever wonder how twilight lost its stature?
thanks for looking into the losing a hit that will make it better.
gromi how do you think twilight stacks up against darkened steel and its unshruggable dam proc? course i could be wrong about it, but just speculating.
illshad what is hard? thorn? more like long and annoying. clouds is hard often. standing 1e of a stack of mobs and continuously spelling up charging and shifting in the dead isnt really hard is it? some skills yes, great eq and lucky rolls yes.
targsk whats an extra 40 damroll on 7 or 8 hits vs a proc that does roughly the same damage plus proc multiple times. as far as i understand it also ignores racial str and bonuses like battletrance/heroism in its calculations. frankly its quite limited and isn't really up to snuff with today's standards.
anyhow ever wonder how twilight lost its stature?
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Corth:
<B>The only common warrior class that doesn't have innate infra are barbarians. Farsee on an item is just about worthless now.. you can pop a potion in those rare circumstances where it would be useful. I'm not sure what other warrior items have sense life.. that could be a big one.
Yeah I think adding an extra round would be a very good compromise.. or even removing those bonuses and upping its damage even more. Thanks for looking into it garg.
Corth
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
If these flags are not special or uber, then why is the amulet of sight so sought after? Seems kinda silly that you dont want all of that on a kick ass weapon and not have to waste the 1/2 or whatever you wear on neck at the time to wear the amulet...those flags, or coarse are more used by explorer classes and zone leaders, but sheesh. We are talking about a weapon that is an amulet of sight with pff and some bad ass hit/dam and procs.
If somebody has a twilight and isnt using it...you should be smacked around, robbed, and thrown in a trash container.
I think you guys said you lose an attack when it procs? well yes that should be changed...a weapon of that stature should have a drawback.
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Kifle "It Slipped I swear!" ButteryFingers
<B>The only common warrior class that doesn't have innate infra are barbarians. Farsee on an item is just about worthless now.. you can pop a potion in those rare circumstances where it would be useful. I'm not sure what other warrior items have sense life.. that could be a big one.
Yeah I think adding an extra round would be a very good compromise.. or even removing those bonuses and upping its damage even more. Thanks for looking into it garg.
Corth
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
If these flags are not special or uber, then why is the amulet of sight so sought after? Seems kinda silly that you dont want all of that on a kick ass weapon and not have to waste the 1/2 or whatever you wear on neck at the time to wear the amulet...those flags, or coarse are more used by explorer classes and zone leaders, but sheesh. We are talking about a weapon that is an amulet of sight with pff and some bad ass hit/dam and procs.
If somebody has a twilight and isnt using it...you should be smacked around, robbed, and thrown in a trash container.
I think you guys said you lose an attack when it procs? well yes that should be changed...a weapon of that stature should have a drawback.
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Kifle "It Slipped I swear!" ButteryFingers
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- Sojourner
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Kifle, amulet of sight has something very big that twilight doesn't have: Detect Invis. How many of those items do you see floating around the game?
I'm not speculating. Barbs are the only real warrior class without infra. The only thing that is arguable as being nifty for warriors on the twilight are farsee and sense life. Most people that have twilights are likely to also have flaming/lightning earrings so there is your farsee. And like i said, sense life is probably VERY nifty from a good weapon like twilight. So I do give credit there where it is due.
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
I'm not speculating. Barbs are the only real warrior class without infra. The only thing that is arguable as being nifty for warriors on the twilight are farsee and sense life. Most people that have twilights are likely to also have flaming/lightning earrings so there is your farsee. And like i said, sense life is probably VERY nifty from a good weapon like twilight. So I do give credit there where it is due.
Corth
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Goddamned slippery mage.
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- Sojourner
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- Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2002 5:01 am
Ya, as we know, warriors shouldn't want to cause damage. Rangers, and Anti's and paladins should cause damage, but WAIT! Evils don't have those classes, so who do we replace them with... warriors. If nothing else, evil warriors want to cause damage.
Twilight proc works as follows. Take your hit/dam, minus your racial stats, minus the twilight stats, minus heroism stats, minus battletrance stats, then double it, then add all the stats back in. In other words, I've yet to see it add 40 damroll. I've seen it add 25-30 damroll for 5-6 attacks and then been gone. While I think gythka procs as much damage, I don't think its as consistant. Then again, gythka has other benifets..
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Gromikazer Terrorforge -Veldruk- Orbdrin D'oloth
Twilight proc works as follows. Take your hit/dam, minus your racial stats, minus the twilight stats, minus heroism stats, minus battletrance stats, then double it, then add all the stats back in. In other words, I've yet to see it add 40 damroll. I've seen it add 25-30 damroll for 5-6 attacks and then been gone. While I think gythka procs as much damage, I don't think its as consistant. Then again, gythka has other benifets..
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Gromikazer Terrorforge -Veldruk- Orbdrin D'oloth
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- Sojourner
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- Sojourner
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I use my Twighlight constantly, I love it. I was even caled Gormal last night for wielding it as only basher, oh the fun. Seriously as a barb warrior who leads lots, it is decidedly sexy.
I agree with Jurdex that I use it for the SL/INFRA/PFF and for the sheer sexiness. The Damage on Ladak is very low already cos I use lots of saves, AC and HP (and ridiculous strength). So when twighlight procs I am still dealing out wussy damage. Since the proc doesnt raise me much cos I have little to start with I find I break mobs faster with a flammy due to lots of damage proc, my 1h weapon is even pretty close.
Oh, prot fire got me in trouble that time I ressed and couldnt wield it or get an earring out hehe...*grins*...good times good times..
The main problem that twighlight has been faced with is that when shieldblock came into play, you lost a major defensive skill if you wanted to go 2h. For large Giant/Efreet/Dragon fights I switch to a shield.
The name and color suite me to a tee. Pls dont change this on the standard issue, if you want to upgrade later, so be it *whistle*. Destruction has always been Ladak's warcry and wearing all black and red and flamning things, this sword sits very nicely. *grins*
Ladak
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I agree with Jurdex that I use it for the SL/INFRA/PFF and for the sheer sexiness. The Damage on Ladak is very low already cos I use lots of saves, AC and HP (and ridiculous strength). So when twighlight procs I am still dealing out wussy damage. Since the proc doesnt raise me much cos I have little to start with I find I break mobs faster with a flammy due to lots of damage proc, my 1h weapon is even pretty close.
Oh, prot fire got me in trouble that time I ressed and couldnt wield it or get an earring out hehe...*grins*...good times good times..
The main problem that twighlight has been faced with is that when shieldblock came into play, you lost a major defensive skill if you wanted to go 2h. For large Giant/Efreet/Dragon fights I switch to a shield.
The name and color suite me to a tee. Pls dont change this on the standard issue, if you want to upgrade later, so be it *whistle*. Destruction has always been Ladak's warcry and wearing all black and red and flamning things, this sword sits very nicely. *grins*
Ladak
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- Sojourner
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agree some sarell disagree that twilight got nerfed by shieldblock. it doesnt stack up to gythka, md sword, perhaps others. the damage calc that gromi indicates i believe was also redone back during the great pre-invoker nerf.
its a great leader weapon always was its primary focus imo. but it was also an uber 2h once upon a time.
its a great leader weapon always was its primary focus imo. but it was also an uber 2h once upon a time.
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