Acheron Tweaks, Pt 2!

[Guest]

There is already a thread on this, but it's severely outdated, and I figured I would get some FRESH input on what needs tweaking in the arena!

I will be running the new and improved Fields of Slaughter (the new name for Fight Club) again soon, and with the reopening of this, I am hoping that Acheron will be balanced so that more people will want to participate!

So...PLEASE give me feedback on what needs adjusting! Serious posts only please, the less that has to be waded through, the faster it will get done.

/\/\alar

[Wargo]

Up spell damage a tad
Lower melee damage a tad
Lower backstab damage a crap load
Lower char skill by half
Lower racial innate skill by half

[Tasan]

Change the arena to be something you enter, then stay in until you are done fighting(achexit).

I.e. make a starting room that is peace, but spells are castable(dunno if this is even possible), that's fast regen(maybe add a mob that heals people over time), that you go to when you enter, and every time you die.

This eliminates the possibility of dying outside of acheron.

This eliminates the need for achexit to lag the hell out of you(though it should still take time to commit i.e. camp).

This eliminates the need for lag on death imo.

Twinshadow

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Tanji group-says 'Twyl keeps thinkin he rolled a rogue'

[Ragorn]

I agree, you should be able to fight multiple battles without needing a cleric. Being sent to a peace room when you die, at full hit points, is a good idea. Let people spell themselves up in there and re-enter when ready.

Secondly, set a state when you enter the arena to record your current character condition... then when you leave the arena, reset the character to the condition he was when he entered. Hit points, active spells and durations, etc. It's silly to lose your barkskin, armor, stone, vit, and whatever else because you die in the arena.

I dunno, haven't fought in there for a while, so someone else can handle the balance issues

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- Ragorn
Jenera says 'i managed to match a little, ragorn's outfit is hideous.'

[Nokie]

http://www.sojourn3.org/ubb/Forum6/HTML/000617.html
http://www.sojourn3.org/ubb/Forum2/HTML/000413.html
http://www.sojourn3.org/ubb/Forum2/HTML/000414.html
http://www.sojourn3.org/ubb/Forum2/HTML/000535.html
http://www.sojourn3.org/ubb/Forum2/HTML/000547.html
http://www.sojourn3.org/ubb/Forum6/HTML/000120.html
http://www.sojourn3.org/ubb/Forum6/HTML/000698.html


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Nokie 'No you don't!! That belongs to me!' Quickfingers

[Rausrh]

Hey! Nokie's gunnin for Tod's job...

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Rausrh licks you.

[Axxsinlazzam]

Please check the damage that ultrablast does in the arena.
It really sucks IMHO atm.
The starting room idea is a VERY good idea.
I hate dieing in the arena and when i come back outside the portal and my last command (which is ultrablast btw)
takes effect.
which forces me into a fight with a mob while i'm low on hp (illithids hp is below mage hp btw).


The Axx
Advisor to the Blood Raiders.

Death to all Invokers!

[Wargo]

Max melee damage output should = max spell damage output.

Ex: If max Inferno damage = 600 points of hp with the fastest casting time of 3 rounds, then max Rogue melee damage over a 3 rounds period should = 600 points of hp, with double backstabs included. However this should not take into effect equipment bonuses.

[Nokie]

The difference is that you can cast infernos over and over. You only get one shot to BS a person (unless they are major paraed). Once you use up that shot, BS isn't an option anymore.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Wargo:
<B>Max melee damage output should = max spell damage output.

Ex: If max Inferno damage = 600 points of hp with the fastest casting time of 3 rounds, then max Rogue melee damage over a 3 rounds period should = 600 points of hp, with double backstabs included. However this should not take into effect equipment bonuses.</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>



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Nokie 'No you don't!! That belongs to me!' Quickfingers

[Jegzed]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Nokie:
<B>The difference is that you can cast infernos over and over. You only get one shot to BS a person (unless they are major paraed). Once you use up that shot, BS isn't an option anymore.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The problem for casters in the arena is that spells are lost whenever target leaves room.


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/Jegzed - Sorcere Master - Crimson Coalition

[Zoldren]

spells lost when left room

you bash/slam lag lasts almost a whole fight or until next bash/slam..
while bashed/slamed you cant do jack..

if a caster stuns you.. you can still flee and hide and other stuff....

melee damage is >>> spell damage

in the 3 rounds it takes to cast 1 good spell
melee gets 3 rounds of the same or more damage that that one spell does

[Glorishan]

A cleric's only use in the arena is to heal other people after they die, basically. Unless you're teaming up, which is often frowned upon (and will be illegal for your fight club, I'm assuming. Perhaps give each person a cleric of their choice for their fight, would make it longer, but make clerics less bored.)

Anyway, yeah it's boring in there for us. Really boring.

Glorishan


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Malar OOC: 'if they were men then damn i'm gay :P'

[moritheil]

I'd like to see team events. Maybe even tag team.

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Iyara tells you 'ahh! hey, you're the spank guy huh - I've seen your logs!'

[Daz]

clerics should have elemental shields, this would help balance them in arena's tremendously.

potions are gonna hurt a mage's big help here, which would be invisibility (who doesn't have di? :P)

make potions not work in acheron
and all spells are dispelled upon entering.

then, warriors can stomp ya, mages can invis, rogues can hide/backstab, and clerics can use elemental shields to supplement damage.

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-Daz "<^> (*¿*) <^>" Proudwolf

[Guest]

Potions are illegal for Fields of Slaughter.

In regards to having character state resume...it couldn't work for 2 reasons.

1. You wouldn't ever lose prestige, because your prestige would go back to where it was before you entered.
2. You could spellup before even entering and keep running in over and over and over again with a free full spellup.


#2 could be countered by making the Acheron portals dispel all magic upon you when entering, but #1 doesn't seem possible.


Keep the ideas coming guys! Try to give me "specific" spells, utilities, skills, etc. that need tweaking.

From the biggest complaints I have are these:

#1. Melee damage too much (disagree, it's the procs that aren't getting put through the damage calculator, that can be fixed)

#2. Rogue backstab is too high (highly agree)

#3. Poisons are too powerful (highly agree)

#4. Melee skills work too often still (highly agree)

#5. Offensive spells not doing nearly enough damage (agree, and hopefully I can get the "outside arena spell damage [inferno, etc]" bug fixed for this too)

#6. Psionicist skills not doing enough damage (highly agree)

#7. Bards suck in arena (disagree, they have backstab now, nuff said)

#8. Need nature rooms. (highly agree, I'll see what I can do about getting some sections of each grid flagged to outdoors and GRID_FOREST)

#9. Need private rooms that only 2 people can fight in (agree, I'll see if I can get a couple set aside for this)

#10. Archery does too much damage (unsure, I'll have to talk to a coder on this, it seems iffy)

Alright guys, keep giving me more stuff!

/\/\alar

[Anaram]

"POWER WORD STUN"
Spell.

Area of effect: <victim>
Aggressive: Yes
Cumulative: No
Duration: Dependent on proficiency of caster
Class/Circle: Invoker 7th, Conjurer 8th
Type of spell: Generic

This spell will stun a victim with less than a certain amount of
lifeforce, with the amount determined by the spellcaster's
proficiency.


< 408h/408H 115v/115V >
< P: rcl > help stun
STUN STUNNED

Especially hard blows have a chance to stun you or your victim. Some of
the effects of being stunned are:

Fleeing won't work.
No singing, camping, casting, fighting abilities (bash, kick, switch
opponets, etc), or using psionic abilities.
Saving throws are adversely effected.
Much easier to steal from.

These are only SOME of the effects, others can be found out by experimenting.

Do you think stun (invokers only chance) could keep them from fleeing per what the helpfile says it is supposed to do.

Thanks
-Ana

[gruldo]

take away wargo's ability to emote in there..

make flee not work as well in there, nothing worse than beating some cleric down to awful and letting them flee all over creation to heal and mem and start over again :P


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Grul-Diggity!

[Tasan]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Malar:
<B>In regards to having character state resume...it couldn't work for 2 reasons.

1. You wouldn't ever lose prestige, because your prestige would go back to where it was before you entered.
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE></B>

Since when did prestige ever make someone want to fight someone in the arena. Make prestige worth something, then you can use this argument. I'm also fairly sure that your prestige before entrance could be set aside in a variable for reevaluation after you exited to determine final value.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2"><B>
2. You could spellup before even entering and keep running in over and over and over again with a free full spellup.

#2 could be countered by making the Acheron portals dispel all magic upon you when entering, but #1 doesn't seem possible.
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE></B>

I'm really confused by this statement. You can reset the players ON ENTRANCE to the arena can't you? Or would that be too unrealistic?


Twinshadow

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Tanji group-says 'Twyl keeps thinkin he rolled a rogue'

[Nokie]

Re #1 and #2: Why can't it be coded such that whenever the restore takes place, it applies the stored affect_prestige(+1/-1) to the char being restored? Is it a lot more complicated than that? I mean you have to know to restore char settings upon exit of archeron and so by definition you can remember what condition they left in the first place and make the appropriate adjustment? Or just do away with prestige gain/loss in acheron alltogether. That would make some people more willing to die lots in there.

Also, if it's a problem with them going bck in right away, then implement the idea I proposed long long ago (and linked to in this thread already):

Have the area work in 'rounds' in which players have a crtain time-limit to enter the waiting area. When the round starts, they are all teleported to a random location in the arena. The battle ends only when one person is left or after a certain set time perod (so people can't camp forever). During the battle new/killed people can't enter until the next round.

re #7: When backstab is nerfed, won't bards then suck?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Malar:
<B>1. You wouldn't ever lose prestige, because your prestige would go back to where it was before you entered.
2. You could spellup before even entering and keep running in over and over and over again with a free full spellup.

#7. Bards suck in arena (disagree, they have backstab now, nuff said)
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

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Nokie 'No you don't!! That belongs to me!' Quickfingers

[This message has been edited by Nokie (edited 09-05-2002).]

[Nokie]

I was air embodied too, Nuff said

You do a fancy maneuver, tripping Weylarii.
Unfortunately, Weylarii proves to be quite agile herself, and you go down as well.
< 678h/726H 120v/120V >
< T: Nokie TC: few scratches E: Weylarii EC: few wounds P: sit >
You barely pierce Weylarii.
The poison on your weapon wears off.
You barely pierce Weylarii.
The poison on your weapon wears off.
You barely pierce Weylarii.
You barely pierce Weylarii.
You barely pierce Weylarii.
Weylarii misses you with her slash.
Weylarii crushes you hard.
Weylarii slashes you hard.
As Weylarii swings her mighty scepter, smashing into you with a solid blow,
the weapon bursts brightly with the strength of her ancestors. The
scepter takes on a life of its own, reversing her swing and striking you again.
Weylarii crushes you very hard.
As Weylarii swings her mighty scepter, smashing into you with a solid blow,
the weapon bursts brightly with the strength of her ancestors. The
scepter takes on a life of its own, reversing her swing and striking you again.
Weylarii crushes you very hard.
Weylarii crushes you very hard.
Weylarii crushes you extremely hard.
Weylarii's scimitar comes to life and blurs as it strikes you.
Weylarii slashes you extremely hard.
Weylarii slashes you extremely hard.
Weylarii slashes you extremely hard.
You stagger from a fearsome slash from Weylarii!
A mighty slash from Weylarii makes you contemplate a new career!
You gasp in pain from Weylarii's awesome slash!
< 94h/726H 120v/120V >
< T: Nokie TC: awful E: Weylarii EC: few wounds P: sit >

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Nokie 'No you don't!! That belongs to me!' Quickfingers

[This message has been edited by Nokie (edited 09-10-2002).]

[Tasan]

Feh, that's Weylarii... get a baseline!



Seriously though, look at the numbers there:
584 hps / 12 = approx 49 damage / hit

Wey has close to that in pure damage. So taking weapon dice into effect, this actually means Wey was way UNDER what should have happened. Seems to me that melee isn't doing 100%, but perhaps needs slight tweaking more downwards.

Twinshadow

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Tanji group-says 'Twyl keeps thinkin he rolled a rogue'

[This message has been edited by Tasan (edited 09-10-2002).]

[Jorus]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Tasan:
<B>Feh, that's Weylarii... get a baseline!
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Also, Weylarii was stoned for the first round there.

A fight without stone in place would be a much better measure.

Also some measure of proc frequency would be useful.

Regards,
Jorus